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Author Topic: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath  (Read 193123 times)

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SDAminister

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3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« on: August 11, 2008, 11:25:00 AM »

With great regret that I am constrained to share the following info with the Advent Talk forum.

This past weekend in Minnesota, Wintley Phipps held two concerts to support his organization the U.S. Dream Academy. 

A few things to note about Elder Phipps and this weekend:


-He is a member of Three Angels Broadcasting Network Board of Directors
-He is an ordained Seventh-day Adventist minister of the Southeastern Conference of Seventh-day Adventists where he pastors the Palm Bay Seventh-day Adventist Church.
-He took a commercial flight to his destination on the Sabbath
-His concerts were at 7:00 pm Saturday and Sunday evenings.
-Admission to the concerts were by paid ticket only; sold in advance, and on the day of the concerts.
-Tickets were sold on the Sabbath by the local sponsor (a bank) and by the local center for the arts box office. Tickets also were for sale at the door, prior to the concert Saturday evening. Price: $12 adults, $6 students.
-A couple of phone calls indicate that members in the Minnesota Conference are concerned that this blatant breaking of the Sabbath, by a minister of their own denomination, will hurt their efforts to proclaim the three angels' message of which the sanctity of God's law is supreme.
-It is understood that this is not a one-time event as Elder Phipps regularly engages in this type of conduct.
-It is further unknown what effect this will have upon the work of 3ABN as Elder Phipps is perhaps one of the most public figures in all of Seventh-day Adventism.

SDAminister
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Maxey

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2008, 12:16:40 PM »

words fail...
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Donna

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2008, 12:38:39 PM »

Words do not fail me. Before this is taken as truth there are some questions to be asked. Did SDA minister witness these things himself or is it a rumor? Did SDA minister go to or contact Elder Phipps concerning this before he called the conference or writing about this on a public forum? In other words was this handled according to Matt. 18 principles? If none of these things were done then SDA minister nor anyone else has a Christian  right to say anything here or to anyone else about Elder Phipps
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bonnie

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2008, 12:47:46 PM »

Quote

With great regret that I am constrained to share the following info with the Advent Talk forum.

This past weekend in Minnesota, Wintley Phipps held two concerts to support his organization the U.S. Dream Academy. 


I do not know who SDA minister is,but I got to tell you this does not sound like regret of any kind. More that every move is watched closely to see if there is an infraction somewhere.


 
Quote
-He is a member of Three Angels Broadcasting Network Board of Directors
-He is an ordained Seventh-day Adventist minister of the Southeastern Conference of Seventh-day Adventists where he pastors the Palm Bay Seventh-day Adventist Church.
-He took a commercial flight to his destination on the Sabbath


Well, my goodness. I live in MN and could not have told you that.



Quote
-His concerts were at 7:00 pm Saturday and Sunday evenings.
-Admission to the concerts were by paid ticket only; sold in advance, and on the day of the concerts.
-Tickets were sold on the Sabbath by the local sponsor (a bank) and by the local center for the arts box office. Tickets also were for sale at the door, prior to the concert Saturday evening. Price: $12 adults, $6 students.

If these are sponsors my guess would be that the SDA church did not have much say over the selling time frame




Quote
-A couple of phone calls indicate that members in the Minnesota Conference are concerned that this blatant breaking of the Sabbath, by a minister of their own denomination, will hurt their efforts to proclaim the three angels' message of which the sanctity of God's law is supreme.

This is the kind of stuff that makes "my mercury" rise.
The MN conference has had many more damaging episodes  to be concerned about and have done nothing nor were there calls to confirm the "deep concern over converts"

To say there is this overriding concern stretches credibility to the max.
Not because it was my family, but the nature of what happened to us was KNOWN AND REPORTED to the MN conference a full year before their hands were forced to be concerned about the sanctity of God's Law. The lesser sin of sexual immorality was not only visited upon my family, but other MN members have had the dubious honor with the same results we ezperienced


Quote
-It is understood that this is not a one-time event as Elder Phipps regularly engages in this type of conduct.
-It is further unknown what effect this will have upon the work of 3ABN as Elder Phipps is perhaps one of the most public figures in all of Seventh-day Adventism.


You know I have a real problem with 3ABN. I have NO RESPECT for DS,none, nada,zero, but this is almost laughable in the detailed chronicling of sins of someone else. My brothers and I had a name for this and used to play a game with it. Not nice but as kids we knew more than our share of those engaged in this. We called it I SPY SIN and it Ain't MINE. Mocking some of the more diligent in tracking sins of my family.

There is enough on the plate of those that run and control 3ABN, enough for DS to explain another marriage and other various dubious sounding actions. All stuff like this does is make them look good by comparison.

Besides who has time to track this much of a detailed account of others.
MN is a lot more liberal in sexual sins apparently than in the rules of the Sabbath.

I have said for over 6 years now I could get more attention and pious support by announcing that "we have decided it is in the health laws that we can now eat pork and have wine with our dinner than if I again announced the pastor of the largest, very liberal church in MN was having a inappropriate sexual relationship with my DIL Then hush, we don't want to cause gossip.





edited to add sentence
« Last Edit: August 11, 2008, 12:52:24 PM by bonnie »
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SDAminister

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2008, 01:05:06 PM »

Words do not fail me. Before this is taken as truth there are some questions to be asked. Did SDA minister witness these things himself or is it a rumor?
Myself not wanting to be a victim of rumor, I verified all info before posting. I spoke by telephone directly with the president of the sponsoring bank, a representative of the center for the arts, and an individual from the venue where the concerts were held. I can supply those phone numbers to anyone who needs them.
You may also verify certain info here from their local newspaper. Note the last paragraph. http://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/news/2008/aug/07/phipps-add-ff-his-world/

Did SDA minister go to or contact Elder Phipps concerning this before he called the conference or writing about this on a public forum? In other words was this handled according to Matt. 18 principles?

Public sins are dealt with publicly. But please read Matt 18. It deals with a trespass by one brother upon another. This did not happen. Elder Phipps did not trespass upon me. Instead, God's law was trespassed. We should be zealous to defend Him. As such, ALL biblical principles dealing with this situations like this have been adhered to.




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bonnie

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2008, 01:11:33 PM »

Words do not fail me. Before this is taken as truth there are some questions to be asked. Did SDA minister witness these things himself or is it a rumor?
Myself not wanting to be a victim of rumor, I verified all info before posting. I spoke by telephone directly with the president of the sponsoring bank, a representative of the center for the arts, and an individual from the venue where the concerts were held. I can supply those phone numbers to anyone who needs them.
You may also verify certain info here from their local newspaper. Note the last paragraph. http://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/news/2008/aug/07/phipps-add-ff-his-world/

Did SDA minister go to or contact Elder Phipps concerning this before he called the conference or writing about this on a public forum? In other words was this handled according to Matt. 18 principles?

Public sins are dealt with publicly. But please read Matt 18. It deals with a trespass by one brother upon another. This did not happen. Elder Phipps did not trespass upon me. Instead, God's law was trespassed. We should be zealous to defend Him. As such, ALL biblical principles dealing with this situations like this have been adhered to.









Strange that this was held in Fergus Falls,MN. Might answer a few questions I had on this
But in reading the newspaper article it does not sound like Elder Phipps was in charge of the selling, where and when.
Wonder if you have ever travelled on the Sabbath when conceivably you could have waited or not travelled.
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Bob Pickle

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2008, 01:20:07 PM »

In other words was this handled according to Matt. 18 principles?

Mat. 18 does not entirely imply when the problem is already a public matter. Correct?

Even so, it doesn't hurt to talk to the person first.

Wintley Phipps performing at Life Church
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Donna

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2008, 01:43:23 PM »

Words do not fail me. Before this is taken as truth there are some questions to be asked. Did SDA minister witness these things himself or is it a rumor?
Myself not wanting to be a victim of rumor, I verified all info before posting. I spoke by telephone directly with the president of the sponsoring bank, a representative of the center for the arts, and an individual from the venue where the concerts were held. I can supply those phone numbers to anyone who needs them.
You may also verify certain info here from their local newspaper. Note the last paragraph. http://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/news/2008/aug/07/phipps-add-ff-his-world/

Did SDA minister go to or contact Elder Phipps concerning this before he called the conference or writing about this on a public forum? In other words was this handled according to Matt. 18 principles?

Public sins are dealt with publicly. But please read Matt 18. It deals with a trespass by one brother upon another. This did not happen. Elder Phipps did not trespass upon me. Instead, God's law was trespassed. We should be zealous to defend Him. As such, ALL biblical principles dealing with this situations like this have been adhered to.






One point not seen is that nothing you have said is verified as you do not have any information from Elder Phipps himself; part of the picture is missing.  Most of the information you got seems to be that which could be used against him. You have accused and judged him guilty before giving him a fair hearing.

I remember once after church services the driver of the car I was in made a turn around in the parking lot of a local drugstore. I saw a member of my church going into the drugstore and commented to the driver why he would be doing that on the Sabbath. The immediate response was that we did not know if he was picking up a prescription from a doctor that was ordered that day.  That was right, we didn't know and had no right to judge our brother.

Another time our church had burned down and local talent in our community put on a benefit concert on a Sat. evening. They knew we went to church on the Sabbath day but they did not know our beliefs on keeping the Sabbath holy. I was a fairly new member and did not know whether I should go or not and prayed about it. I went and found that most of the church members had gone too. They were a great witness to me about the following.

Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier [matters] of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.  
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SDAminister

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2008, 02:48:55 PM »

Words do not fail me. Before this is taken as truth there are some questions to be asked. Did SDA minister witness these things himself or is it a rumor?
Myself not wanting to be a victim of rumor, I verified all info before posting. I spoke by telephone directly with the president of the sponsoring bank, a representative of the center for the arts, and an individual from the venue where the concerts were held. I can supply those phone numbers to anyone who needs them.
You may also verify certain info here from their local newspaper. Note the last paragraph. http://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/news/2008/aug/07/phipps-add-ff-his-world/

Did SDA minister go to or contact Elder Phipps concerning this before he called the conference or writing about this on a public forum? In other words was this handled according to Matt. 18 principles?

Public sins are dealt with publicly. But please read Matt 18. It deals with a trespass by one brother upon another. This did not happen. Elder Phipps did not trespass upon me. Instead, God's law was trespassed. We should be zealous to defend Him. As such, ALL biblical principles dealing with this situations like this have been adhered to.









Strange that this was held in Fergus Falls,MN. Might answer a few questions I had on this
But in reading the newspaper article it does not sound like Elder Phipps was in charge of the selling, where and when.
Wonder if you have ever travelled on the Sabbath when conceivably you could have waited or not travelled.

So, are you saying that Elder Phipps, the founder and president of US Dream Academy, had no input as to how and when the tickets were to be sold, the proceeds of which were to his organization's full benefit?

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Bob Pickle

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2008, 02:50:52 PM »

Donna, people all around here got word that Phipps was going to perform, and how to buy tickets. Anyone who wants to can confirm the basic facts without going to Phipps.

Yet there are some things that only Phipps can tell us.
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Donna

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2008, 02:56:21 PM »

Until someone has all the facts I consider it all to be rumor and choose not to listen or respond to it any further.
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bonnie

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2008, 03:08:50 PM »


Quote
So, are you saying that Elder Phipps, the founder and president of US Dream Academy, had no input as to how and when the tickets were to be sold, the proceeds of which were to his organization's full benefit?


No, that is not what I said. Had this been brought to his attention beforehand or even after this was planned,I am sure he could have had input. The fact he didn't would tell me he probably was not concerned about the time frame and selling tickest. Or, it could have been a simple oversight in planning.

Where this whole thing leaves me cold and it begins to look like "I gotcha" mentality was when you threw in the concern by MN conference.

Quote
A couple of phone calls indicate that members in the Minnesota Conference are concerned that this blatant breaking of the Sabbath, by a minister of their own denomination, will hurt their efforts to proclaim the three angels' message of which the sanctity of God's law is supreme.

It is further unknown what effect this will have upon the work of 3ABN as Elder Phipps is perhaps one of the most public figures in all of Seventh-day Adventism.

Not to much further than a stones throw of the MN conference there is an adventist church. One which blatantly disregards the sabbath, or at least used to. Using the children of Pathfinders. Sabbath afternoons were spent many times in doing yard work, washing windows,shoveling snow on sabbath to prove SDA's weren't legalists . I don't recall the MN conference getting to excited as many left that church for another.  This was not work that could in any way be called a type of emergency . Deliberately planned for Sabbath afternoon.

The conference president was present many times for a musical group that had the Sabbath service. I do not like the slow,droning music some seem to think is the only appropriate. When it gets to be the type that a visitor to the church sitting behind me tapped me on the shoulder and said "I can cancel my plans for the dance this evening, I can hear the lesson study and dance all in one trip", and got up and left, It is a little much for me



I simply do not believe that many paid attention to all of the minute detail going into this and called the conference.
Had it been held here I can tell you it is unlikely I would hahve known what time the plane landed etc.

Somone was looking to find and play "I Spy Sin" More so because there is a connection to 3ABN.

I would think if this presented such a big problem for the saints of MN,they should have stayed away. Unfortunate if they broke the Sabbath on this,but if as you say this is not the first time,it likely has passed muster with our liberal MN conference
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bonnie

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2008, 03:12:03 PM »

This is another part of the story I do not buy........


With great regret that I am constrained to share the following info with the Advent Talk forum.




I think it was with great delight instead of regret. About the only thing you left out was what they had for breakfast and what time.
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Sister

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #13 on: August 11, 2008, 03:20:14 PM »

In reading the article linked from the newspaper, am I the only one who noticed that no mention was made of Pastor Phipps having any affiliation with the Seventh-Day Adventist Church?
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bonnie

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Re: 3ABN Board Member Breaks Sabbath
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2008, 03:21:07 PM »

Quote
Donna, people all around here got word that Phipps was going to perform, and how to buy tickets. Anyone who wants to can confirm the basic facts without going to Phipps.


Then why wait till AFTER the program to wring hands over breaking of the sabbath. I would think that important enough that the conference office was called BEFORE with concern how it would will hurt their efforts to proclaim the three angels' message of which the sanctity of God's law is supreme.--It is further unknown what effect this will have upon the work of 3ABN as Elder Phipps is perhaps one of the most public figures in all of Seventh-day Adventism.


Not after the fact . Sorry, not buying your "regret to inform"
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