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[Johann]

A good friend of mine who is a policeman tells me many criminals are never punished because their defense attorneys are experts at spinning and turning and asking all kinds of irrelevant questions whereby they manage to create a very small doubt by which the guilty is exonerated.

There was a case where four policemen not in uniform tried to arrest thugs beating up innocent people. Even though the policemen verified they had each shown their police identification the defense attorney twisted their testimony, questioning and re-questioning them until he managed to create a doubt whether the thugs had all understood they were policemen when they attacked them. The doubt resulted in a full acquittal.

[Chrissie]

A good friend of mine who is a policeman tells me many criminals are never punished because their defense attorneys are experts at spinning and turning and asking all kinds of irrelevant questions whereby they manage to create a very small doubt by which the guilty is exonerated.

It is the defence attorney's job to get his client 'off the hook'. Just don't let the truth get in the way of a 'true story'.

[Artiste]

A good friend of mine who is a policeman tells me many criminals are never punished because their defense attorneys are experts at spinning and turning and asking all kinds of irrelevant questions whereby they manage to create a very small doubt by which the guilty is exonerated.

Could you see a scenario where an attorney created enough reasonable doubt concerning Danny Shelton's actions to cause a jury to exonerate him?

My belief is that regardless of the outcome of lawsuits (which we wish to go well for our side!), it is necessary to publicize wrongdoing by a Seventh-day Adventist church-related organization.

Wrongdoings that are being ignored by the SDA church leadership and any new-and-improved 3ABN administration! 

[Artiste]

And among all the various wrongdoings, one of the worst was the slandering of the reputaton of a woman who was Vice-President and Co-Founder of the 3ABN organization!

[Gailon Arthur Joy]

A good friend of mine who is a policeman tells me many criminals are never punished because their defense attorneys are experts at spinning and turning and asking all kinds of irrelevant questions whereby they manage to create a very small doubt by which the guilty is exonerated.

There was a case where four policemen not in uniform tried to arrest thugs beating up innocent people. Even though the policemen verified they had each shown their police identification the defense attorney twisted their testimony, questioning and questioning them until he managed to create a doubt whether the thugs had all understood they were policemen when they attacked them. The doubt resulted in a full acquittal.

In a criminal prosecution the jury is held to a standard of finding "guilt" by weighing the evidence and determining that the defendant is guilty "beyond a reasonable doubt".

In a civil case, the jury must find liability and damages by weighing the evidence based upon the standard of the "propensity of the evidence". Their game will be to continue to try and prevent the introduction of the evidence and we must use the rules if evidence to get the evidence into the record and before the jury. The evidence heavily weighs against them and they most certainly know that or they would not keep coming back to the same process of trying to protect evidence from discovery or, if discovered, to protect it from dissemination and ultimately to find a way to keep it from coming into the hands of the jury pool. That, in summary, is the game!!!

They also have a major problem that has come into the strategic mix...a criminal investigation by the IRS which is highly prejudicial and usually inadmissible. BUT, they alleged defamation per se and made a big deal about the premise that the allegations we have made accused 3ABN and the Founder of criminal activity...and now they have accidentally laid the foundation for the introduction of the investigation and the implications including expert testimony!!! Tough life if you are a lawyer for 3ABN and Danny lee Shelton, et al.

Gailon Arthur Joy

[Artiste]

A good friend of mine who is a policeman tells me many criminals are never punished because their defense attorneys are experts at spinning and turning and asking all kinds of irrelevant questions whereby they manage to create a very small doubt by which the guilty is exonerated.

There was a case where four policemen not in uniform tried to arrest thugs beating up innocent people. Even though the policemen verified they had each shown their police identification the defense attorney twisted their testimony, questioning and re-questioning them until he managed to create a doubt whether the thugs had all understood they were policemen when they attacked them. The doubt resulted in a full acquittal.

In a criminal prosecution the jury is held to a standard of finding "guilt" by weighing the evidence and determining that the defendant is guilty "beyond a reasonable doubt".

In a civil case, the jury must find liability and damages by weighing the evidence based upon the standard of the "propensity of the evidence". Their game will be to continue to try and prevent the introduction of the evidence and we must use the rules if evidence to get the evidence into the record and before the jury. The evidence heavilly weighs against them and they most certainly know that or they would not keep coming back to the same process of trying to protect evidence from discovery or, if discovered, to protect it from dissemination and ultimately to find a way to keep it from coming into the hands of the jury pool. That, in summary, is the game!!!

They also have a major problem that has come into the strategic mix...a criminal investigation by the IRS whiich si highly prejudicial and usually inadmissable. BUT, they alleged defamation per se and made a big deal about the premise that the allegations we have made accused 3ABN and the Founder of criminal activity...and now they have accidentally laid the foundation for the introduction of the investigation and the implications including expert testimony!!! Tough life if you are a lawyer for 3ABN and Danny lee Shelton, et al.

Gailon Arthur Joy

Well...what can I say!

[Ozzie]

A good friend of mine who is a policeman tells me many criminals are never punished because their defense attorneys are experts at spinning and turning and asking all kinds of irrelevant questions whereby they manage to create a very small doubt by which the guilty is exonerated.

There was a case where four policemen not in uniform tried to arrest thugs beating up innocent people. Even though the policemen verified they had each shown their police identification the defense attorney twisted their testimony, questioning and questioning them until he managed to create a doubt whether the thugs had all understood they were policemen when they attacked them. The doubt resulted in a full acquittal.

In a criminal prosecution the jury is held to a standard of finding "guilt" by weighing the evidence and determining that the defendant is guilty "beyond a reasonable doubt".

In a civil case, the jury must find liability and damages by weighing the evidence based upon the standard of the "propensity of the evidence". Their game will be to continue to try and prevent the introduction of the evidence and we must use the rules if evidence to get the evidence into the record and before the jury. The evidence heavily weighs against them and they most certainly know that or they would not keep coming back to the same process of trying to protect evidence from discovery or, if discovered, to protect it from dissemination and ultimately to find a way to keep it from coming into the hands of the jury pool. That, in summary, is the game!!!

They also have a major problem that has come into the strategic mix...a criminal investigation by the IRS which is highly prejudicial and usually inadmissible. BUT, they alleged defamation per se and made a big deal about the premise that the allegations we have made accused 3ABN and the Founder of criminal activity...and now they have accidentally laid the foundation for the introduction of the investigation and the implications including expert testimony!!! Tough life if you are a lawyer for 3ABN and Danny lee Shelton, et al.

Gailon Arthur Joy

Seems to me like they want the truth, the whole truth and NOTHING LIKE THE TRUTH!

[Artiste]

"I received a letter from Attorney Hayes yesterday. She has withdrawn the subpoena to Calvin and has given us 10-business-day notice prior to again issuing a subpoena on April 7."

Bob gave us this update on another thread...

I'm wondering what significance it has...

Also Bob's "no comment" type of answer as to what was happening with the Bluehost subpoena didn't really give us a lot of information.

He did say, I think, that more would come later...will we get some hard facts at some point?! 

[Gailon Arthur Joy]

"I received a letter from Attorney Hayes yesterday. She has withdrawn the subpoena to Calvin and has given us 10-business-day notice prior to again issuing a subpoena on April 7."

Bob gave us this update on another thread...

I'm wondering what significance it has...

Also Bob's "no comment" type of answer as to what was happening with the Bluehost subpoena didn't really give us a lot of information.

He did say, I think, that more would come later...will we get some hard facts at some point?! 

This is a case where patience will be in order as it will be a process to unravel what has already occurred here. Just another battle where the battleplan is a
bit privileged, at this point.

Gailon Arthur Joy

[Snoopy]

I hope Attorney Hayes is appropriately appreciative of this little lesson in "How to Issue a Valid Subpoena 101".  How embarrassing to have to learn how to operate as an attorney from two pro se defendants...regardless of how smart they are!!

I am still not too impressed with BlueHost's rollover strategy in complying with a defective subpoena though.

This is a case where patience will be in order as it will be a process to unravel what has already occurred here. Just another battle where the battleplan is a
bit privileged, at this point.

Gailon Arthur Joy

[Artiste]

"They also have a major problem that has come into the strategic mix...a criminal investigation by the IRS which is highly prejudicial and usually inadmissible. BUT, they alleged defamation per se and made a big deal about the premise that the allegations we have made accused 3ABN and the Founder of criminal activity...and now they have accidentally laid the foundation for the introduction of the investigation and the implications including expert testimony!"

Gailon, in the above you were explaining that the IRS criminal investigation of 3ABN can now be brought into court as evidence because of the defamation accusations of 3ABN's lawyers?

Am I understanding that correctly?

[Artiste]

I hope Attorney Hayes is appropriately appreciative of this little lesson in "How to Issue a Valid Subpoena 101".  How embarrassing to have to learn how to operate as an attorney from two pro se defendants...regardless of how smart they are!!

I am still not too impressed with BlueHost's rollover strategy in complying with a defective subpoena though.

This is a case where patience will be in order as it will be a process to unravel what has already occurred here. Just another battle where the battleplan is a
bit privileged, at this point.

Gailon Arthur Joy

I totally agree, Snoopy!

I'm wondering if the good attorney will become more and more embarrassed as time goes on!

[Ozzie]

I hope Attorney Hayes is appropriately appreciative of this little lesson in "How to Issue a Valid Subpoena 101".  How embarrassing to have to learn how to operate as an attorney from two pro se defendants...regardless of how smart they are!!

I am still not too impressed with BlueHost's rollover strategy in complying with a defective subpoena though.

This is a case where patience will be in order as it will be a process to unravel what has already occurred here. Just another battle where the battleplan is a
bit privileged, at this point.

Gailon Arthur Joy

I totally agree, Snoopy!

I'm wondering if the good attorney will become more and more embarrassed as time goes on!

Intersting days ahead again? 

[Artiste]

Hey, Bob, isn't it funny how reasonable and pliable they can be when pushing the protective order before the judge? I had to crack up when she was explaining just how reasonable they had been during the Protective Order Stipulation discussions???

She was T'ed off over your production of her "confidential" email discussions with you. Wonder how horrified she would have been if you gave the judge the entire log?

If we win, I guarantee they will not De Nouveau to Judge Saylor!!! He would most probably be not the least bit bemused by the stall and hold tactics. But what else do you have when you do not have the facts on your side???

Gailon Arthur Joy
 

I assume that "stall and hold tactics" can lengthen the entire proceedings...

[Gregory]

A decision has been made in the attempt of Bob Pickle to subopena ceratin bank records in MN:

1) The bank has been ordered to provide the requested document, but ONLY to the Magistrate located in MA who is in charge of that aspect of the lawsuit there.

2) Bob Pickle has been ordered to pay the bank all reasonable costs the it incurs in providing the documents referenced above.  The bank is not obligated to send the documents to MA until Bob pays them their fee.

3) All documents are under seal and are not to be shared with anyone else which includes Bob Pickle and Gailon Joy.

4) Others (including  Bob and Gailon) may petition the court in MA for access to those documents and the MA court may grant such access as it believes is justified.

5) The motion of Danny Shelton to quash the subponea is denied.

6) The motion to deny Mr. Shelton's motion to quash is denied as it is moot.

My analysis:  It is a win for both sides. But, the importance is not known at this time. I.e.  It may be of no consequence or or may be of major consequence.  It is premature for either side to trumpet this as a major win.

NOTE: As I am not an attorney and I am not trained in law, my comment above is not to be construed as giving a legal opinon or any kind of legal advice.  It is simply a personal opinon of mine.