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[Sister]

I arrived home from North Dakota a few days ago and opened up Advent Talk.  Much to my dismay, I found all the "surmising" and "assuming" regarding the letter I wrote about Barbara.  I am a retired Life Insurance agent and many years ago, my  supervisor told me never to assume anything because those who do, are usually wrong and it makes everyone look bad.  Plainly speaking, your assumptions are wrong.

For those who asked, I'll tell you why Barbara did not write the letter herself.  She, like Linda, does not go on any forum any more, nor has she since she came home from Norway and tried to write.  Reading all the "stuff" people wrote was just too upsetting for her and her health could not take it.  Over the past year, I would go on BSDA and see that there were some people sincerely asking about her and I'd relay that on, letting her know she did have many friends genuinely concerned about her health and how she was doing. 

We discussed how best to let those who love her know she was much better and we decided that I would be the one to write the letter.  I posted it on BSDA and, (this is for you, Sister) I decided to also post it on Advent Talk (knowing many of her friends were also reading here) ~ THEN, I informed Barbara on the following day of what I had done.  This was NOT about playing games, Sister. Barbara has never gone to Advent Talk and, as I said before, she also no longer visits BSDA.

 Sorry Grammie T, Barbara won't be coming on this forum or any other.  I am Barbara's mother and thank you for the apology.  Like I said in the letter; God, in His own time, will reveal what He wants known.  The purpose of my letter was to let those who wanted to know 'why' Barbara hadn't written sooner ~ the "Why" - and that she is doing fine.  I also want to let you "naysayers" know that I keep in contact with Linda and talk to her on the phone, the last time being just two weeks ago.  We see each other when our paths cross.

I want to thank those of you (Grandmad, Servant, Ian, Habanero, Fran and many others) for your kindness shown to Barbara and who have been appreciative for the update.  For those who don't know, you may go to BSDA and open the Praise and Testmony thread where you will find Barbara's 'Love Letter From Norway'.  To read her "Open Letter" explaining her involvement with 3ABN, click on 3ABN (Links and Resources) here on Advent Talk.

Barbara has the following statement by H.M.S. Richards, Sr. posted in her office and around her house so she can read it readily throughout the day.  Perhaps everyone should read it at least once a day to keep focused on what is truly important in life!!

Keep At Your Work
 

"The Lord has given to every man his work.  It is his business to do it and the devil's business to hinder him if he can.  So, surely as God has given you a work to do, Satan will try to hinder you.  He may present other things more promising.  He may allure you by worldly prospects.  He may assult you with slander, torment you with false accusations, set you to work defending your character, employ pious persons to lie about you, editors to assail you, and excellent men to slander you.  You may have Pilate and Herod, Annas and Caiaphas all combined against you, and Judas standing by ready to sell you for thirty pieces of silver; and you may wonder why all those things come to you.  Can you not see that the whole thing is brought about through the craft of the devil to draw you off from your work and hinder your obedience to God?

Keep about your work.  Do not flinch because the lion roars, do not stop to stone the devil's dogs; do not fool away your time chasing the devil's rabbits.  Do your work.  Let liars lie, let sectarians quarrel, let corporations resolve, let editors publish, let the devil do his worst; but see to it that nothing hinders you from fulfilling the work that God has given you.

He has not sent you to make money.  He has not commanded you to get rich.  He has never bidden you to defend your character.  He has not set you at work to contradict falsehood which Satan and his servants may start to peddle.  If you do these things, you will do nothing else; you will be at work for yourself and not for the Lord.

Keep about your work.  Let your AIM be as steady as a star.  Let the world brawl and bubble.  You may be assaulted, wronged, insulted, slandered, wounded and rejected; you may be abused by foes, forsaken by friends, and despised and rejected of men, but see to it with steadfast determination, with unfaltering zeal, that you pursue the great purpose of your life and object of your being, until at last you can say, 'I have finished the work which Thou gavest me to do.'  By: H.M.S. Richards, Sr., Founder of Voice of Prophecy.

Barbara is determined to be about her Lord's work.  She is happy, content and full of joy.  She loves people and is doing all she can to fulfill the covenant she made with God when she was dying of Crohn's Disease ~ that if He would spare her life, she would spend the rest of her life helping people to never get as sick as she was.  God honored that prayer and is blessing her beyond measure.  I am thankful I have such a Godly daughter who loves Jesus with all her heart!

I pray for God's blessings on all of you.
Jo Ann

Jo Ann, I asked you a question in a Private Message on another Forum (BSDA) and rather than answering it privately there, you bring it up publically here. Why? What is your purpose? In God's time perhaps the truth about why Barbara was asked to leave Norway may come to light. It says much more about certain aspects of her character than a mother may choose to admit. Many mothers have a blind spot when it comes to the characters of their beloved child and are willing to defend that child no matter the circumstances.

Sister

[GrammieT]

Dear JoAnn: 

First of all, I know that all of us are very glad to hear that Barbara is doing well.

Thank you for getting back to us.  However your further comments leave somewhat to be desired.  Your original post mentioned: 

"It has been a little over a year since she has returned home from Norway and as she contemplated writing you all a letter (and she did start a few times) ~ she just didn't quite know what to say; Or, should I say, she didn't know what NOT to say.  Last fall, she felt impressed not to post anything at that time, and given the direction the law suits have taken, I believe it was a wise decision to remain silent.

Her prayer has always been for the Lord to show her what the truth is regarding the 3ABN saga, and it was very interesting that while in Norway, He did just that.  She originally planned a 2 month stay for treatment but then it was extended an additional month.  Due to needing still more treatment, the doctor advised that she remain for the fourth month.  Had Barbara returned home at the end of two months, or even three months, the information given her that fourth month just wouldn't have happened.  Not that she pursued it...she didn't, not even knowing that it existed but, perhaps it was Providential that her stay was extended?  We think so.  Barbara was surprised, and disappointed, in what she learned and she struggled with what to share with all you folks.  After several attempts at writing, but not comfortable with posting her findings, she has put it in the Lord's Hands and in His time, He will reveal all."

The underlined portion above is what is causing all the controversy.  Perhaps it would have been better not to have said anything at all rather than what was said. Are you saying that the truth is different than what she testified to in her letter to BSDA before she went to Norway?  Did the Lord show her that something that we all believe is less than the truth?  Otherwise, why would she find it so hard to tell?  And it sems a little late to be bringing it up at all unless you are going to be completely forthcoming with all that was learned.

And what does Sister mean when she says:  "Jo Ann, I asked you a question in a Private Message on another Forum (BSDA) and rather than answering it privately there, you bring it up publically here. Why? What is your purpose? In God's time perhaps the truth about why Barbara was asked to leave Norway may come to light. It says much more about certain aspects of her character than a mother may choose to admit. Many mothers have a blind spot when it comes to the characters of their beloved child and are willing to defend that child no matter the circumstances.

Sister"

Just what does the bolded statement mean, Sister?  Can you enlighten us?  These posts just make everything that much more questionable, IMHO, and frankly, I getting more than a little tired of all the cloak and dagger innuendo that it generates.   

Please, everybody, stop all the 'suggestive nonsense' and TELL ALL OF THE TRUTH! for a change.  I'm sorry for yelling, but . . . 


GrammieT

[GrandmaNettie]

Dear JoAnn: 

First of all, I know that all of us are very glad to hear that Barbara is doing well.

Thank you for getting back to us.  However your further comments leave somewhat to be desired.  Your original post mentioned: 

"It has been a little over a year since she has returned home from Norway and as she contemplated writing you all a letter (and she did start a few times) ~ she just didn't quite know what to say; Or, should I say, she didn't know what NOT to say.  Last fall, she felt impressed not to post anything at that time, and given the direction the law suits have taken, I believe it was a wise decision to remain silent.

Her prayer has always been for the Lord to show her what the truth is regarding the 3ABN saga, and it was very interesting that while in Norway, He did just that.  She originally planned a 2 month stay for treatment but then it was extended an additional month.  Due to needing still more treatment, the doctor advised that she remain for the fourth month.  Had Barbara returned home at the end of two months, or even three months, the information given her that fourth month just wouldn't have happened.  Not that she pursued it...she didn't, not even knowing that it existed but, perhaps it was Providential that her stay was extended?  We think so.  Barbara was surprised, and disappointed, in what she learned and she struggled with what to share with all you folks.  After several attempts at writing, but not comfortable with posting her findings, she has put it in the Lord's Hands and in His time, He will reveal all."

The underlined portion above is what is causing all the controversy.  Perhaps it would have been better not to have said anything at all rather than what was said. Are you saying that the truth is different than what she testified to in her letter to BSDA before she went to Norway?  Did the Lord show her that something that we all believe is less than the truth?  Otherwise, why would she find it so hard to tell?  And it sems a little late to be bringing it up at all unless you are going to be completely forthcoming with all that was learned.

And what does Sister mean when she says:  "Jo Ann, I asked you a question in a Private Message on another Forum (BSDA) and rather than answering it privately there, you bring it up publically here. Why? What is your purpose? In God's time perhaps the truth about why Barbara was asked to leave Norway may come to light. It says much more about certain aspects of her character than a mother may choose to admit. Many mothers have a blind spot when it comes to the characters of their beloved child and are willing to defend that child no matter the circumstances.

Sister"

Just what does the bolded statement mean, Sister?  Can you enlighten us?  These posts just make everything that much more questionable, IMHO, and frankly, I getting more than a little tired of all the cloak and dagger innuendo that it generates.   

Please, everybody, stop all the 'suggestive nonsense' and TELL ALL OF THE TRUTH! for a change.  I'm sorry for yelling, but . . . 


GrammieT

GrammieT, the cryptic bits dropped here and there tend to give the impression that one member or another "knows" something juicy and that tends to titillate.  The downside of titillating was described by Bill Moyers: "Once you decide to titillate instead of illuminate . . . you create a climate of expectation that requires a higher and higher level of intensity".

Does anyone actually believe that hints and innuendo increase one's credibility?  For some it may, but for those attempting to use critical thinking and get actual facts, it does not.

It is also possible that some stay cryptic or less than straight forward with their information because they are just not completely certain it is valid.  Perhaps this is the case with the two posters you are addressing your reply to.

For example, I was told a year ago, in person by someone who would very likely know, what had taken place in that Norway clinic in 2007.  At the time I had no reason not to believe what I was told.  However, I was told several other things at the time, as well, that seemed hard to believe.  I checked these other things out with 2 - 3 people who i knew would have the information, close supporters of the individual, and was told that the person had gotten the details confused as the person often did.  If two of the stories I was told by this person were inaccurate, how could I trust that the story about the Norway clinic was accurate?  I couldn't.  I would not  pass that story on publically for that very reason.

Is it possible that the innuendo and the dripping of cryptic bits will stop?  Doubtful.  The appetite for it is just too great.....supply and demand drives more than the economy.

[guide4him]

Joann I am very glad your daughter has moved on with her ministry and is doing wonderful. I do miss her.

Yes, some things should have been better left unsaid instead of teasing us with so many strange statements. Sometimes it is best to do a preview and make sure what you typed is what you really wanted to say. Delete key can be so handy at times.

I remember reading about Hemingway's way of writing. Get rid of all unnecessary words. Make your story say meaningful powerful things in very short concise sentences. there may be more to add, this is all I remember at this time. Halfsheimers coming up.

[Habanero]

One thing we all know is that anyone who joins the fray on either side will be shredded into coleslaw no matter what they know, or think they know. There is no clean and graceful entry, stay or exit from the 3ABN scandals.

[Bob Pickle]

I suppose I've been shredded into pickle relish?

[GrandmaNettie]

One thing we all know is that anyone who joins the fray on either side will be shredded into coleslaw no matter what they know, or think they know. There is no clean and graceful entry, stay or exit from the 3ABN scandals.

Agree.  And why is that? Both sides appear to believe strongly that they are on a righteous crusade to protect the integrity of God's work, His church.  Both believe they are right and the other side wrong.  All see themselves as marching around Jericho tooting their holy horns.  But what are the spoils that are to be reserved for God's treasury?  Hello?  The only spoils of true value to God are the humans that are being shredded into coleslaw.  So, everyone ends up being Achan.  There are no winners.

Perhaps we need to review our marching orders.  Astounding what will be done in the name of the Lord.

[Bob Pickle]

Both sides appear to believe strongly that they are on a righteous crusade to protect the integrity of God's work, His church.  Both believe they are right and the other side wrong.

I highly doubt that.

[Sister]

Both sides appear to believe strongly that they are on a righteous crusade to protect the integrity of God's work, His church.  Both believe they are right and the other side wrong.

I highly doubt that.

I agree with Bob...

[Gregory]

Both sides appear to believe strongly that they are on a righteous crusade to protect the integrity of God's work, His church.  Both believe they are right and the other side wrong.

I highly doubt that.

Come now.  One might say that there are well-informed, active people on both sides who do not believe that they are on a righteouls crusade. 

Even if one did this, surely one would still say that there are many on each side who are on a righteours crusade to protect the integrity of God's work and His church.

NOTE: On a personal basis, I am willing to acknowledge that all involved people beleive that they are on a righteous crusade.

[Artiste]

Both sides appear to believe strongly that they are on a righteous crusade to protect the integrity of God's work, His church.  Both believe they are right and the other side wrong. 

. . . Perhaps we need to review our marching orders.  Astounding what will be done in the name of the Lord.

Both sides may believe that they are on the right track, but only one side has the evidence to prove it.

High-sounding spiritual statements cannot hide this fact.

[Bob Pickle]

No, I don't believe that both sides believe they are right.

I do not believe that Danny Shelton and Walt Thompson believe they are right in claiming that Danny had biblical grounds for divorce since Danny admitted after the divorce that he didn't know whether Linda had committed fornication or not.

I do not believe that Danny and Walt are in the same position as the religious leaders of Christ's time who thought they were doing God's service when they hired false witnesses and lied and murdered.

Perhaps I am naive, but that is my opinion at present.

[Artiste]

No, I don't believe that both sides believe they are right.

I do not believe that Danny Shelton and Walt Thompson believe they are right in claiming that Danny had biblical grounds for divorce since Danny admitted after the divorce that he didn't know whether Linda had committed fornication or not.

I do not believe that Danny and Walt are in the same position as the religious leaders of Christ's time who thought they were doing God's service when they hired false witnesses and lied and murdered.

Perhaps I am naive, but that is my opinion at present.

If one side does not believe, even if that reservation is deep in their psyche, that their cause is a just one, then they are treading on thin ice.

Just like in Johann's dream...

[GrandmaNettie]

Both sides appear to believe strongly that they are on a righteous crusade to protect the integrity of God's work, His church.  Both believe they are right and the other side wrong. 

. . . Perhaps we need to review our marching orders.  Astounding what will be done in the name of the Lord.

Both sides may believe that they are on the right track, but only one side has the evidence to prove it.

High-sounding spiritual statements cannot hide this fact.

Which side is that, Artiste?

[Bob Pickle]

No, I don't believe that both sides believe they are right.

I do not believe that Danny Shelton and Walt Thompson believe they are right in claiming that Danny had biblical grounds for divorce since Danny admitted after the divorce that he didn't know whether Linda had committed fornication or not.

I do not believe that Danny and Walt are in the same position as the religious leaders of Christ's time who thought they were doing God's service when they hired false witnesses and lied and murdered.

Perhaps I am naive, but that is my opinion at present.

If one side does not believe, even if that reservation is deep in their psyche, that their cause is a just one, then they are treading on thin ice.

Just like in Johann's dream...

My point was not necessarily whether they thought their cause was a just one. My point was that I do not believe Danny and Walt think that it is right and correct and just and righteous to say that Danny had biblical grounds for divorce in the light of Danny's statement to the contrary.

Neither do I think that Danny and Walt believe it is right and correct and just and righteous to cover up child molestation allegations, or to claim that a thorough investigation was done when not one alleged victim or their families were contacted by Walt.