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[Gailon Arthur Joy]

I'm sorry. Maybe you did not read all of Mr. Pickles posts and how his story changed each time he was questioned.  I'm afraid a child would question the different variations that were given.  It certainly makes one stop and think that if he could change a minute story that many times, what will he do with something bigger?

For those who like to name call. I take offense to being called a Dannyclone simply because I think Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy have been less than honest and ethical in their actions.  Obviously to your way of thinking, if you agree with Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy then you are PickledJoy clones?  I haven't read where those that share my opinion have resorted to name calling because you have a different opinion.  It is childish, false and unproductive to any discussion.

Now, if this is about honesty and ethics, there I will directly challenge your assertion. You must state specifically and in detail what has been dishonest and what has been unethical and I shall be happy to respond. After all, that is a major part of our allegations about Danny, Tommy and 3ABN.

But, since we are addressing honesty and ethics, you must be just frustrated to peices over the factually challenged statements of Danny Lee Shelton and Walt Thompson..and what about the failure to produce evidence for nearly four years? Wouldn't you just be a whole lot more comfortable if they would put those cards on the table and let the chips fall where they may?

If I were in your shoes, I would be loathe to talk of ethics when the 3ABN Board voted to file a lawsuite rather than meet in person or utilize an ecclesiatical process. And then claim the lawsuite was to bring out all the truth, but move to impound? Ethics? Honesty? A bit wanton, wouldn't you say?

And under the assumption that you may be still a bit blind to the truth, then I will go the next step and question your own ethics and honesty? Just how much proof do you need to know you must act
to bring the poor deluded souls back from the brink? Would any amount of evidence convert you? And if it would, please let me know what it is so we can "in-doctrinate you".

Gailon Arthur Joy

[Habanero]

Wow, Anyman, that is an interesting accusation you have leveled against them here. Did you interview them and take notes? Did you visit them and record the conversation? Did you get signed affidavits? Oh, you said "It seems." So perhaps you are subtly suggesting that they are subtly suggesting something?  

Also, have you noticed people talking about "following Jesus' example?" Does that imply that they are subtly suggesting that they are Gods and saviours on a par with Jesus?

GAJoy said, 1) I would like the quote from EG White to support that short sighted tale!!! Mrs White wrote how many letters that have been published over the years to point out the sins of the church and specific individuals? Something we have unfortunately set aside. If we had done that in the Davenport Affair as we were suppose to do, we probably would have avoided a few more stewardship messes, including 3ABN and Danny Lee Shelton, (See Who Watches? Who Cares pgs 55 to 108 for documentation);

It sure seems that this Joy and Pickle guys are trying to subtly suggest they are the same as Ellen White. As if they concider themselves the same as someone who was a real prophet and called by God to do his work. That would seem like a dangerously bold thing to claim.

It is also weird that when they are presented with a question they do a lot of macho bragging and finger pointing. The Mr. Pickle guy also seems to go on and on about just one issue. It would make a reader wonder if he has some experiences in his past that cuased him pain and this is a way to deal with it.

[Snoopy]

I'm thinking anyman is sounding very familiar...like I may have read his writings in a prior life...

[Gailon Arthur Joy]

I said he would answer my questions with more accusations and that is exactly what he did.  Looking at previous posts I see it is a pattern.

I beg to differ, Sam, I ANSWERED YOUR COMMENTS. Apparently, you are not use to answers!!! THOSE WERE ANSWERS: clear and precise. Don't forget, Sam, you are the "ethics and honesty" guy. Yes it is time for ethics and honesty. Time to answer the questions!!!

There is either substance to what you allege, or you are ethically challenged!!!  

Gailon Arthur Joy

[anyman]

Not preaching at all there Ms. Snoopy. but it is a bit strange you moderating a forum on an adventist web site when you don't agree with the things adventists believe. Are you taking out your frustrations on 3ABN? I read somewhere that anything you do is no one's fault but your own, something about being critters of free will and no one being able to make you do anything you don't choose to do.

Perhaps you'd like to take care of the log in your own eye before you worry about the speck in mine.  If you're trying to preach Adventism to me here, don't bother...3ABN has already turned me off!!!

Sounds like the Word and reading it makes some uncomfortble which is a little strange considering this is a place is suppose to be where people who believe in it gather to talk. The pharasiess didn't like the Word either, made them uncomfortble.

[GrandmaNettie]

Bob, could I get just a bit of clarification about the former mayor of Thompsonville story?

Part of the confusion has resulted because my answers fit the questions I was asked. Look at the questions I was asked and look at my answers, and it should be fairly clear what I meant by what I said. Try not to read anymore into what I wrote than what I wrote.

Bob, I pondered on the questions asked as well as your answers.  The various forms your answers took raised further questions which led me to ask for the clarification.  I would not have done so if I could have figured out the bottom line from what was there in print.  The form or manner of communication one chooses to use plays largely in the grasp, the depth of understanding for those on the receiving end of said communication.  Should you wish to be clearly understood, communicate with clarity.  If you prefer to leave questions.... well, you know what to do.

I would appreciate it if you could simply answer the following question. A simple "yes" or "no" will do.

Did the former mayor of Thompsonville personally (phone, personal letter, email, fax, face-to-face) tell you the story that you shared with us?

Thanks

[Gailon Arthur Joy]

Bob, I pondered on the questions asked as well as your answers.  The various forms your answers took raised further questions which led me to ask for the clarification.  I would not have done so if I could have figured out the bottom line from what was there in print.  The form or manner of communication one chooses to use plays largely in the grasp, the depth of understanding for those on the receiving end of said communication.  Should you wish to be clearly understood, communicate with clarity.  If you prefer to leave questions.... well, you know what to do.

I would appreciate it if you could simply answer the following question. A simple "yes" or "no" will do.

Did the former mayor of Thompsonville personally (phone, personal letter, email, fax, face-to-face) tell you the story that you shared with us?

Thanks

Grandma Nettie:

Bob is off to a constituency meeting and therefore not readily available. Let me clarify the sources and verification:
1) We had the story from three other sources including other journalists;
2) There was a direct face to face meeting to verify and clarify the story and thus did meet the Mayor of Thompsonville and a former 3ABN Director at the same time;
3) The original document from 3ABN Atty D. Michael Riva to the Mayor stating there would be consequences (unspecified in the letter) for their pursuit of the tax case against 3ABN is safely in the hands of a journalist at this time;
4) 3ABN ran full page adds in the local newspaper to try and convince other churches to join them in their case against the Illinois DOR.

Now, Grandma Nettie, is that sufficient or do you need further clarification to pass along?

By the way, I hear a mutual friend has threatened full scale war if we pursue an inquiry into professional conduct? Tell the mutual friend that the inquiry will proceed. If there is No Basis, nothing to worry about. But, since communication is conditional, options are a bit limited.

You must make it clear to our friend conditions on communications are unacceptable. I do not negotiate terms for any communication. Particularly, revelation of sources. In fact, I am not known to negotiate much of anything.

Gailon Arthur Joy

[Snoopy]

Anyman...

Please point out EXACTLY where you saw me say that I "don't agree with the things adventists believe."  And by the way...the term "Adventist" is a proper noun and really should be capitalized.  Now, what I don't agree with is the way many Adventists ACT...starting right there in Thompsonville!!!  If Danny Shelton is the "face of Adventism"...then I'll go non-denominational!!  Oh yeah - 3ABN IS non-denominational...  Oh my - I get so confused...

Not preaching at all there Ms. Snoopy. but it is a bit strange you moderating a forum on an adventist web site when you don't agree with the things adventists believe. Are you taking out your frustrations on 3ABN? I read somewhere that anything you do is no one's fault but your own, something about being critters of free will and no one being able to make you do anything you don't choose to do.

Perhaps you'd like to take care of the log in your own eye before you worry about the speck in mine.  If you're trying to preach Adventism to me here, don't bother...3ABN has already turned me off!!!

Sounds like the Word and reading it makes some uncomfortble which is a little strange considering this is a place is suppose to be where people who believe in it gather to talk. The pharasiess didn't like the Word either, made them uncomfortble.

[anyman]

ADMIN HAT ON


Anyman,

You WILL refrain from name calling, and you will address other posters appropriately.  I have edited your post accordingly.


ADMIN HAT OFF



no need to take any notes there Mr. Habanero. They keep just writing them out themselves now don't ya see. A person doens't have to go talk to them cause they just keep doing it in public. as for the following Jesus example thing. Well I suppose that someone might take the angle if you read the papers it seems Oprah is doing it so I'm thinking some people do it. Of course anyone who doesn't fancy themselves more important that God's word wouldn't do so. Think I remember the whole problem with Lucifer was he was jealous that God didn't let him in on the creation and started to think more of himself than he should have.

Written after Ms. Snoopy's editing - I changed the name cause I wasnt writing to Mr. Pickle. I figured since Mr. Habanero believes Mr. Pickle then the name I used fit sorry about that Mr. Habanero.

Wow, Anyman, that is an interesting accusation you have leveled against them here. Did you interview them and take notes? Did you visit them and record the conversation? Did you get signed affidavits? Oh, you said "It seems." So perhaps you are subtly suggesting that they are subtly suggesting something? 

Also, have you noticed people talking about "following Jesus' example?" Does that imply that they are subtly suggesting that they are Gods and saviours on a par with Jesus?

GAJoy said, 1) I would like the quote from EG White to support that short sighted tale!!! Mrs White wrote how many letters that have been published over the years to point out the sins of the church and specific individuals? Something we have unfortunately set aside. If we had done that in the Davenport Affair as we were suppose to do, we probably would have avoided a few more stewardship messes, including 3ABN and Danny Lee Shelton, (See Who Watches? Who Cares pgs 55 to 108 for documentation);

It sure seems that this Joy and Pickle guys are trying to subtly suggest they are the same as Ellen White. As if they concider themselves the same as someone who was a real prophet and called by God to do his work. That would seem like a dangerously bold thing to claim.

It is also weird that when they are presented with a question they do a lot of macho bragging and finger pointing. The Mr. Pickle guy also seems to go on and on about just one issue. It would make a reader wonder if he has some experiences in his past that cuased him pain and this is a way to deal with it.

[Cindy]

Bob, could I get just a bit of clarification about the former mayor of Thompsonville story?

Part of the confusion has resulted because my answers fit the questions I was asked. Look at the questions I was asked and look at my answers, and it should be fairly clear what I meant by what I said. Try not to read anymore into what I wrote than what I wrote.

That's as clear as mud...

There appears to be alot of different things being discussed or brought up in this thread which was started on the topic of Gossip and hearsay.  The effect is somewhat confusing and chaotic, at least to me.

Would it be possible to at least get all the posts having to do with the ex- Mayor of Thompsonville story moved to it's own thread?

[Snoopy]

No.  I don't see why that is necessary at all.  Reddogs started a thread to discuss gossip and hear-say.  Now several of you are attacking Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy for alleged gossip and hear-say.  I think this is a perfect place for this discussion to take place.

Bob, could I get just a bit of clarification about the former mayor of Thompsonville story?

Part of the confusion has resulted because my answers fit the questions I was asked. Look at the questions I was asked and look at my answers, and it should be fairly clear what I meant by what I said. Try not to read anymore into what I wrote than what I wrote.

That's as clear as mud...

There appears to be alot of different things being discussed or brought up in this thread which was started on the topic of Gossip and hearsay.  The effect is somewhat confusing and chaotic, at least to me.

Would it be possible to at least get all the posts having to do with the ex- Mayor of Thompsonville story moved to it's own thread?

[Habanero]

Sam had said something about not having ever seen anyone from the other side calling people names. I was about to point this out to him as an example, but thats ok, I am sure he will get the point. (Btw, I am not Mr. Pickle, I am Habanero, in spite of the name calling by Anyman.)

ADMIN HAT ON


Anyman,

You WILL refrain from name calling, and you will address other posters appropriately.  I have edited your post accordingly.


ADMIN HAT OFF



no need to take any notes there Mr. Pickle. They keep just writing them out themselves now don't ya see. A person doens't have to go talk to them cause they just keep doing it in public. as for the following Jesus example thing. Well I suppose that someone might take the angle if you read the papers it seems Oprah is doing it so I'm thinking some people do it. Of course anyone who doesn't fancy themselves more important that God's word wouldn't do so. Think I remember the whole problem with Lucifer was he was jealous that God didn't let him in on the creation and started to think more of himself than he should have.

Wow, Anyman, that is an interesting accusation you have leveled against them here. Did you interview them and take notes? Did you visit them and record the conversation? Did you get signed affidavits? Oh, you said "It seems." So perhaps you are subtly suggesting that they are subtly suggesting something? 

Also, have you noticed people talking about "following Jesus' example?" Does that imply that they are subtly suggesting that they are Gods and saviours on a par with Jesus?

GAJoy said, 1) I would like the quote from EG White to support that short sighted tale!!! Mrs White wrote how many letters that have been published over the years to point out the sins of the church and specific individuals? Something we have unfortunately set aside. If we had done that in the Davenport Affair as we were suppose to do, we probably would have avoided a few more stewardship messes, including 3ABN and Danny Lee Shelton, (See Who Watches? Who Cares pgs 55 to 108 for documentation);

It sure seems that this Joy and Pickle guys are trying to subtly suggest they are the same as Ellen White. As if they concider themselves the same as someone who was a real prophet and called by God to do his work. That would seem like a dangerously bold thing to claim.

It is also weird that when they are presented with a question they do a lot of macho bragging and finger pointing. The Mr. Pickle guy also seems to go on and on about just one issue. It would make a reader wonder if he has some experiences in his past that cuased him pain and this is a way to deal with it.

[anyman]

I'm not sure but let me check did you say this, "If you're trying to preach Adventism to me here, don't bother...3ABN has already turned me off!!!"? I think that is looking like you don't believe cause why would you believe in something that your turned off about? It seems strange that you seem to be put out by someone preaching Adventism at a site that claims to be Adventist.

Anyman...

Please point out EXACTLY where you saw me say that I "don't agree with the things adventists believe."  And by the way...the term "Adventist" is a proper noun and really should be capitalized.  Now, what I don't agree with is the way many Adventists ACT...starting right there in Thompsonville!!!  If Danny Shelton is the "face of Adventism"...then I'll go non-denominational!!  Oh yeah - 3ABN IS non-denominational...  Oh my - I get so confused...

Not preaching at all there Ms. Snoopy. but it is a bit strange you moderating a forum on an adventist web site when you don't agree with the things adventists believe. Are you taking out your frustrations on 3ABN? I read somewhere that anything you do is no one's fault but your own, something about being critters of free will and no one being able to make you do anything you don't choose to do.

Perhaps you'd like to take care of the log in your own eye before you worry about the speck in mine.  If you're trying to preach Adventism to me here, don't bother...3ABN has already turned me off!!!

Sounds like the Word and reading it makes some uncomfortble which is a little strange considering this is a place is suppose to be where people who believe in it gather to talk. The pharasiess didn't like the Word either, made them uncomfortble.

[Cindy]

No.  I don't see why that is necessary at all.  Reddogs started a thread to discuss gossip and hear-say.  Now several of you are attacking Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy for alleged gossip and hear-say.  I think this is a perfect place for this discussion to take place.

Fine, but please get your facts straight. I have attacked no one, all I did was post some questions I had, and then quote some texts and an article which is relevant to this topic.

BTW, just wondering but is calling people "Dannyclones" name calling?  

Bob, could I get just a bit of clarification about the former mayor of Thompsonville story?

Part of the confusion has resulted because my answers fit the questions I was asked. Look at the questions I was asked and look at my answers, and it should be fairly clear what I meant by what I said. Try not to read anymore into what I wrote than what I wrote.

That's as clear as mud...

There appears to be alot of different things being discussed or brought up in this thread which was started on the topic of Gossip and hearsay.  The effect is somewhat confusing and chaotic, at least to me.

Would it be possible to at least get all the posts having to do with the ex- Mayor of Thompsonville story moved to it's own thread?

[/quote]

[Snoopy]

Well, I'm sure you'll figure it out...  I think I explained myself quite clearly.

I'm not sure but let me check did you say this, "If you're trying to preach Adventism to me here, don't bother...3ABN has already turned me off!!!"? I think that is looking like you don't believe cause why would you believe in something that your turned off about? It seems strange that you seem to be put out by someone preaching Adventism at a site that claims to be Adventist.

Anyman...

Please point out EXACTLY where you saw me say that I "don't agree with the things adventists believe."  And by the way...the term "Adventist" is a proper noun and really should be capitalized.  Now, what I don't agree with is the way many Adventists ACT...starting right there in Thompsonville!!!  If Danny Shelton is the "face of Adventism"...then I'll go non-denominational!!  Oh yeah - 3ABN IS non-denominational...  Oh my - I get so confused...

Not preaching at all there Ms. Snoopy. but it is a bit strange you moderating a forum on an adventist web site when you don't agree with the things adventists believe. Are you taking out your frustrations on 3ABN? I read somewhere that anything you do is no one's fault but your own, something about being critters of free will and no one being able to make you do anything you don't choose to do.

Perhaps you'd like to take care of the log in your own eye before you worry about the speck in mine.  If you're trying to preach Adventism to me here, don't bother...3ABN has already turned me off!!!

Sounds like the Word and reading it makes some uncomfortble which is a little strange considering this is a place is suppose to be where people who believe in it gather to talk. The pharasiess didn't like the Word either, made them uncomfortble.