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[Bob Pickle]

From that other site:

And any thinking person knows that if DS had been receiving illegal kickbacks on royalties that the IRS would have nailed him!

Since the kickbacks are a proven fact, what you have just stated is proof that the IRS did not exonerate Danny Shelton. Therefore, what happened to make the IRS investigation go away?

Once again you are trying to turn truth into a lie. You know that 3ABN has a letter (it was published) by Jerry Duffy that the IRS has dropped all claims against 3ABN and they gave 3ABN the choice of either having them, the IRS destroy the over 100,000 pages of documents or sending all the documents back to 3ABN. End of story! Do you think Jerry Duffy would still be practicing law if he wrote such a lie against the IRS?

Your trouble is, that you don't understand that most people think rationally!

Pickle: YOU HAVEN'T QUOTED ONE SOURCE for this lie! Could you please show us a sworn statement from someone who has any information about an IRS payment from 3ABN to make the IRS go away? Pickle, could you even quote an undocumented source? Any name would help. Why would anyone not want to go public with such a claim if they are telling the truth?

Walt Thompson will affirm that Jerry Duffy gave 3ABN a written letter explaining that the IRS case was over. No charges were made. No money ever paid to the IRS.

Gerry Duffy was 3ABN's attorney, not the IRS's attorney. Therefore, anything Gerry Duffy writes about what the IRS found or didn't find is only hearsay. He can't testify to what the IRS did or did not find, not in court.

And remember, Duffy is the guy who claimed non-existent common law copyright protection for his nasty Jan. 2007 letter. Not exactly the most accurate lawyer out there, is he? And strange that the only lawyer in Siegel Brill that was in the case against us that still works for Siegel Brill is Penwell. The other four, including Duffy, are gone.

And Walt admits that he knows nothing firsthand from the IRS either. All his affidavit gives is hearsay.

You are the one denying 3ABN's claim there was no pay off...the burden of proof is on you..... un-named sources will not help you win a smear campaign in the pews!

No. The burden of proof is on the one making the claim, and that is Walt, Danny, Gilley, and 3ABN. Settle the matter once and for all by getting 3ABN to provide us with an IRS form that would allow the IRS to give us information about the investigation. We will then get that information from the IRS and publish it to the world.

The very fact that they refuse to allow the IRS to talk is evidence that the whole claim is a lie. Remember, they tried to stop our subpoena to obtain this very information. If they weren't trying to hide something, they would have welcomed our subpoena, not tried to stop it.

In conclusion, Lilly, put up your evidence of an IRS vindication, and that no money exchanged hands. Put up evidence that comes directly from the IRS, the ones who did the investigation.

As far as who our sources are, get a signed waiver from 3ABN that will waive all claims of damages against any of our sources, and we can see if our sources will give us a release regarding disclosing their names. Beyond just releasing claims, the waiver should also commit 3ABN to paying damages if Danny or anyone else tries to interfere with a source's employment, church relationship, etc. The waiver should be fairly comprehensive along these lines. Get the waiver to me and I will see what I can do.

[Artiste]

From that other site:

And any thinking person knows that if DS had been receiving illegal kickbacks on royalties that the IRS would have nailed him!

Since the kickbacks are a proven fact, what you have just stated is proof that the IRS did not exonerate Danny Shelton. Therefore, what happened to make the IRS investigation go away?

Once again you are trying to turn truth into a lie. You know that 3ABN has a letter (it was published) by Jerry Duffy that the IRS has dropped all claims against 3ABN and they gave 3ABN the choice of either having them, the IRS destroy the over 100,000 pages of documents or sending all the documents back to 3ABN. End of story! Do you think Jerry Duffy would still be practicing law if he wrote such a lie against the IRS?

Your trouble is, that you don't understand that most people think rationally!

Pickle: YOU HAVEN'T QUOTED ONE SOURCE for this lie! Could you please show us a sworn statement from someone who has any information about an IRS payment from 3ABN to make the IRS go away? Pickle, could you even quote an undocumented source? Any name would help. Why would anyone not want to go public with such a claim if they are telling the truth?

Walt Thompson will affirm that Jerry Duffy gave 3ABN a written letter explaining that the IRS case was over. No charges were made. No money ever paid to the IRS.

Gerry Duffy was 3ABN's attorney, not the IRS's attorney. Therefore, anything Gerry Duffy writes about what the IRS found or didn't find is only hearsay. He can't testify to what the IRS did or did not find, not in court.

And remember, Duffy is the guy who claimed non-existent common law copyright protection for his nasty Jan. 2007 letter. Not exactly the most accurate lawyer out there, is he? And strange that the only lawyer in Siegel Brill that was in the case against us that still works for Siegel Brill is Penwell. The other four, including Duffy, are gone.

And Walt admits that he knows nothing firsthand from the IRS either. All his affidavit gives is hearsay.

You are the one denying 3ABN's claim there was no pay off...the burden of proof is on you..... un-named sources will not help you win a smear campaign in the pews!

No. The burden of proof is on the one making the claim, and that is Walt, Danny, Gilley, and 3ABN. Settle the matter once and for all by getting 3ABN to provide us with an IRS form that would allow the IRS to give us information about the investigation. We will then get that information from the IRS and publish it to the world.

The very fact that they refuse to allow the IRS to talk is evidence that the whole claim is a lie. Remember, they tried to stop our subpoena to obtain this very information. If they weren't trying to hide something, they would have welcomed our subpoena, not tried to stop it.

In conclusion, Lilly, put up your evidence of an IRS vindication, and that no money exchanged hands. Put up evidence that comes directly from the IRS, the ones who did the investigation.

As far as who our sources are, get a signed waiver from 3ABN that will waive all claims of damages against any of our sources, and we can see if our sources will give us a release regarding disclosing their names. Beyond just releasing claims, the waiver should also commit 3ABN to paying damages if Danny or anyone else tries to interfere with a source's employment, church relationship, etc. The waiver should be fairly comprehensive along these lines. Get the waiver to me and I will see what I can do.

How does 3ABN go about refusing the IRS to talk?  What happened there?

[Artiste]

I remember that a year or two ago some were claiming that the IRS investigation was not over.

Does anyone know if it is still going on?

[Daryl Fawcett]

So the IRS can be bought off, as in bribed, to cease their investigation, etc.

[Artiste]

That's an interesting way of looking at it!

[ex3abnemployee]

LOL. It's hilarious how Debb...er, I mean...Lilly...tries to act tough and demand evidence and witnesses. She has no clue how irrelevant she is.

[Bob Pickle]

How does 3ABN go about refusing the IRS to talk?  What happened there?

A federal statute prohibits the IRS from discussing taxpayer return information, including investigation information, with third parties. If there is criminal prosecution, or if the taxpayer signs a certain form, then that's a different story.

I remember that a year or two ago some were claiming that the IRS investigation was not over.

Does anyone know if it is still going on?

It's hard to know exactly what has happened. As far as what was claimed in the past, it was claimed that 3ABN had provided no evidence to prove that the IRS investigation was over, and that total vindication by the IRS was impossible given the proven kickbacks and private inurement.

So the IRS can be bought off, as in bribed, to cease their investigation, etc.

The IRS wants its money. If you give them their money, then an investigation can end, of course. I don't know how that would be considered a bribe.

LOL. It's hilarious how Debb...er, I mean...Lilly...tries to act tough and demand evidence and witnesses. She has no clue how irrelevant she is.

Maybe we've made a mistake. It was Breezy that claimed to be Junebug, I think. Who then might Lilly be?

[~ Cindy]

How does 3ABN go about refusing the IRS to talk?  What happened there?

A federal statute prohibits the IRS from discussing taxpayer return information, including investigation information, with third parties. If there is criminal prosecution, or if the taxpayer signs a certain form, then that's a different story.

Over the years you and joy have accused those at 3ABN of "crimes" and yet the investigation did not result in an indictment, yet you still maintain that crimes were committed. This makes no sense, especially considering no ammended tax forms have been filed.

I remember that a year or two ago some were claiming that the IRS investigation was not over.

Does anyone know if it is still going on?

It's hard to know exactly what has happened. As far as what was claimed in the past, it was claimed that 3ABN had provided no evidence to prove that the IRS investigation was over, and that total vindication by the IRS was impossible given the proven kickbacks and private inurement.

It was claimed?!?
To be precise: Bob Pickle claimed all of this. He believes he proved  "kickbacks and private inurement." but the IRS did not reach those same findings, this is proven by the lack of indictment, and the lack of amended filings which would have been required at the very least.. This is in fact part of the very evidence  which supports and proves the announcement by the lawyers, 3ABN President, 3ABN board chairman, and Danny Shelton. (I will be quoting them all here this evening...)

It is also hard to understand why Bob was accusing 3ABN of destroying documents ( another false accusation) for the longest time when he found out that the IRS after investigating asked 3ABN if they wanted the copies of documents back or for them to be destroyed, and now claims there is no evidence or proof that the investigation ended. That makes no sense. Why would the IRS return all copied documents or destroy them if the investigation had not ended?

It's NOT  hard to know exactly what has happened, as Pickle claims, unless like Pickle and Joy you can't admit you were/are wrong.

So the IRS can be bought off, as in bribed, to cease their investigation, etc.

The IRS wants its money. If you give them their money, then an investigation can end, of course. I don't know how that would be considered a bribe.

Of course that is a bribe. You can't just pay the IRS money to make an investigation go away. That is a crime. If the IRS did that, they would be guilty of a crime also.

Of course the IRS wants their money, IF IT IS OWED, but if they make a finding that money is owed, then documentation as in amended filings would prove that. There are none.

All Bob has as proof is "an unnamed person told me." that is not proof that is rumor and hearsay. ( Yet he is accusing 3ABN of going by hearsay because the lawyers they hired to represent them with the IRS investigation told them the investigation was over- his accusation is absurd) On the other hand known individuals are all saying the opposite and the lack of amended filings- public filings- and lack of indictment proves the IRS found nothing wrong, whether it be error or crime.

More later...

[horsethief]

I don't know anyone who would stay at the side of a person that knowingly attempted to cover up child molestation.

[~ Cindy]

I don't know anyone who would stay at the side of a person that knowingly attempted to cover up child molestation.

This appears to be an ad hominem and also off topic imo... but on the off chance that you are being sincere? Then, that's good, I don't know anyone who would do that either...

(Ad Hominem:
adjective
1. appealing to one's prejudices, emotions, or special interests rather than to one's intellect or reason.
2. attacking an opponent's character rather than answering his argument. )

[Bob Pickle]

Over the years you and joy have accused those at 3ABN of "crimes" and yet the investigation did not result in an indictment, ...

So? There are lots of times where there is no indictment, and yet a crime has still been committed. Take for example Tommy Shelton. He committed crimes for years, and never was indicted until 2010.

I use the word "crimes" only because you are.

... yet you still maintain that crimes were committed. This makes no sense, especially considering no ammended tax forms have been filed.

Got the signed release yet so we can find out what really happened? I agree that it does leave some questions. Here we have proven irregularities, such as kickbacks, and no public paper trail documenting what the IRS did about it, but we do have sources saying that the IRS was paid over $1 million. So we need you to get the signed release so we can get the IRS to talk.

Do you know the proper IRS form that qualifies as a release?

To be precise: Bob Pickle claimed all of this. He believes he proved  "kickbacks and private inurement." but the IRS did not reach those same findings, this is proven by the lack of indictment, and the lack of amended filings which would have been required at the very least.

We have the Remnant documents, remember? Simpson admitted that the Remnant documents show payments to Danny by Remnant for sales of PPPA booklets to 3ABN. That's a kickback.

So the kickbacks are proven. Get over it.

As far as private inurement goes, we published the 1998 real estate deal long ago, and Simpson admitted that the IRS didn't go back that far, to 1998. So again, get over it.

Of course that is a bribe. You can't just pay the IRS money to make an investigation go away. That is a crime. If the IRS did that, they would be guilty of a crime also.

I think you are mistaken.

Of course the IRS wants their money, IF IT IS OWED, but if they make a finding that money is owed, then documentation as in amended filings would prove that. There are none.

Get the release, Cindy. Otherwise, the IRS won't be able to make the paperwork public.

But we've already gone over this, more than once. The fact that you don't want to acknowledge this very valid point speaks volumes: The IRS can't talk unless the taxpayer signs a form allowing it to.

( Yet he is accusing 3ABN of going by hearsay because the lawyers they hired to represent them with the IRS investigation told them the investigation was over- his accusation is absurd)

Which lawyer(s), Cindy? Duffy's letter, as I recall, doesn't specify which lawyer the IRS talked to. Please name the lawyer(s) you are referring to. Additionally, even Duffy and Thompson both acknowledged that the IRS never told them that the investigation was over. So where are you coming up with this from?

On the other hand known individuals are all saying the opposite and the lack of amended filings- public filings- and lack of indictment proves the IRS found nothing wrong, whether it be error or crime.

We want real evidence. We want a statement from the IRS saying exactly what happened. We can't get that statement without a release.

The fact that Danny and 3ABN won't give that release, even four years later, "proves" that the whole IRS vindication tale is a farce.

[Daryl Fawcett]

Only the guilty have something to hide, therefore, if Danny Shelton/3ABN are not guilty, then why won't they sign the release?