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[Bob Pickle]

From http://www.blacksda.com/forums/index.php?act=findpost&hl=maternity&pid=241394

Di, don't put words in my mouth that I didn't say. "It's all right as long as no one knew about it" came out of the air. I never said any such thing.

As far as the next red highlighted sentence you evidently have no idea how the IRS works. To hear your scenerio, they got some calls, breezed in to 3abn, GLANCED at 23 years of financial records (right there on the premesis) and said "hey looks good. You're in the clear". Pleeeease. Surely you don't believe that?
The IRS comes in and removes literally thousands of records from the financial dept. While they are there they question relevant people. When that is finished, they leave with the records and it is usally months and months before you hear anything one way or the other. This case has been held up even more by the investigating agent going on maternity leave. (FHB was correct when he made that statement)

Nothing is ever simple with the IRS and you will find that out if you are ever audited.

[Johann]

Quite a significant confession considering earlier claims.

[Artiste]

Do you get the impression that Appletree has somehow been deluded as to what has actually gone on at 3ABN, or the he/she is just spinning the evidence?

[Chrissie]

Do you get the impression that Appletree has somehow been deluded as to what has actually gone on at 3ABN, or the he/she is just spinning the evidence?

My impression is that Appletree is well and truly 'in the know' and is spinning the evidence.

[inga]

You know, I really hate to be a wet blanket on the celebration of the "opposition's" stupidity, BUT the title of this thread is wrong. It's spinning the original post.

Appletree wrote this:

you evidently have no idea how the IRS works. To hear your scenerio .. <snipped>
The IRS comes in and removes literally thousands of records from the financial dept. While they are there they question relevant people. When that is finished, they leave with the records and it is usally months and months before you hear anything one way or the other. This case has been held up even more by the investigating agent going on maternity leave. (FHB was correct when he made that statement)

I'm glad you gave the context, Bob, because that makes clear that Appletree's intention was to indicate "how the IRS works." Appletree did not say that the IRS removed literally thousands of records from the financial dept of 3ABN!

Now, it may very well be true that that's what happened, but that's not what he wrote!

Your testimony would look much more credible if you stuck to the bare facts.

You know, the current situation with the 3ABN lawsuit reminds me of something Ellen White wrote re the American Civil War. She had a vision in which she saw that the Lord did not allow the Northern forces to win because the North did not have the right reasons for the war. It was only after the Emancipitation Declaration that the North was allowed to win. I may not have this exactly right, but that's the gist.

The moral of the story -- the way I see it -- is that God cannot bless our endeavors if we use the enemy's tactics to try to do the work of the Lord. In fact, we may be hampering what the Lord wants to do.

So, I'll say it again. Let's really try to stick to the Golden Rule.
 

[Bob Pickle]

Hi Inga.

I agree that not everyone will interpret what AppleTree wrote the way I did, but I think my read of his statement is correct. If I am misunderstanding him, he is free to correct me.

To hear your scenerio, they got some calls, breezed in to 3abn, GLANCED at 23 years of financial records (right there on the premesis) and said "hey looks good. You're in the clear".

In these words he is clearly talking about the IRS coming in and looking at 3ABN's financial records. It's just that he is trying to correct what he claims is a misperception of  how that actually took place. In correcting how the investigation actually took place he then states:

The IRS comes in and removes literally thousands of records from the financial dept. While they are there they question relevant people. When that is finished, they leave with the records and it is usally months and months before you hear anything one way or the other. This case has been held up even more by the investigating agent going on maternity leave. (FHB was correct when he made that statement)

He most definitely is talking about how a typical criminal investigation takes place. But he is also clearly talking about how the investigation at 3ABN took place.

[Artiste]

I agree, Bob.  That sounds the most reasonable.

[Gailon Arthur Joy]

Hi Inga.

I agree that not everyone will interpret what AppleTree wrote the way I did, but I think my read of his statement is correct. If I am misunderstanding him, he is free to correct me.

To hear your scenerio, they got some calls, breezed in to 3abn, GLANCED at 23 years of financial records (right there on the premesis) and said "hey looks good. You're in the clear".

In these words he is clearly talking about the IRS coming in and looking at 3ABN's financial records. It's just that he is trying to correct what he claims is a misperception of  how that actually took place. In correcting how the investigation actually took place he then states:

The IRS comes in and removes literally thousands of records from the financial dept. While they are there they question relevant people. When that is finished, they leave with the records and it is usally months and months before you hear anything one way or the other. This case has been held up even more by the investigating agent going on maternity leave. (FHB was correct when he made that statement)

He most definitely is talking about how a typical criminal investigation takes place. But he is also clearly talking about how the investigation at 3ABN took place.

Add to this that we have reports from witnesses stating that the IRS took out several boxes of documents and have interviewed most of the financial office staff and several others in Administration and you have Appletree stating rare historical facts that do not appear factually challenged. We even know that financial staff are under the strictest orders not to speak to anyone regarding anything that has happened and we are told this order came from both sides!!!

So enjoy the breathe of fresh air and take in the rare factual assessment and give the man his dues. If he is like so many that we have worked with over the past year and a half, there is a great probability that even he will convert and recognize the truth and join the ranks of reformers!!!

Gailon Arthur Joy

[inga]

Gailon and Bob:

My post was merely meant to point out that Bob misrepresented what Appletree actually wrote. Whether or not Bob's take describes what happened is not the issue.

However, Appletree did not write what Bob claims he wrote in the subject line: "AppleTree says IRS removed 1000's of documents from 3ABN)"! And it does not look good for truth-seekers to misrepresent/spin what others wrote.

Gailon wrote:

Add to this that we have reports from witnesses stating that the IRS took out several boxes of documents and have interviewed most of the financial office staff and several others in Administration and you have Appletree stating rare historical facts that do not appear factually challenged. We even know that financial staff are under the strictest orders not to speak to anyone regarding anything that has happened and we are told this order came from both sides!!!

This may very well be true. However, I am less likely to believe either you or Bob when I see misrepresentations like those of Appletree's post. How do I know that what you report as fact -- as Bob did in the title of this thread-- is not similarly spun from scanty evidence?

All who wish to defend the truth need to be scrupulously truthful.

[Artiste]

I feel that Bob's reading of what appletree said on BlackSDA was something that a lot of other people would understand also.

It seems like hairsplitting to parse appletree's statements so finely.

[Snoopy]

Thank God, Artiste!!  I so agree with you!  I was having a hard time understanding what the problem was, but thought maybe it was just me.

[Bob Pickle]

My post was merely meant to point out that Bob misrepresented what Appletree actually wrote. Whether or not Bob's take describes what happened is not the issue.

I respect your opinion that I misrepresented what he wrote, even while I maintain that I did not represent anything. I understand why you came to this conclusion, even though I have reached a different conclusion.

[Artiste]

From Gailon,

"Add to this that we have reports from witnesses stating that the IRS took out several boxes of documents and have interviewed most of the financial office staff and several others in Administration..."

If what Fran says is true, it sounds like the IRS does plan to go to court--or whatever is the IRS equivalent--with this situation.

[inga]

I think it likely that when Appletree described "how the IRS works," that he described what actually happened at 3ABN. However, anyone who reads the original post can see that's not what he actually wrote.

Sorry if I seem picky, but if we intend to deal in truth we cannot afford to use our conclusions as evidence against someone. (I.e. Like Bob, I concluded that Appletree probably described an actual event with which he was familiar and that that event probably took place at 3ABN. However, that is my conclusion; it is not what he wrote.)

And I also agree with Artiste that, if Fran's description is correct, a criminal court case may be in the offing. However, this bit of apparent evidence is not proof.

It is likely that IRS agents have more than one way of working. If an investigation looks like it might result in a crimnal court case and it is likely to take days or weeks to investigate, it would not be prudent for them to leave documents on the premises, since these could be destroyed/doctored at night.

Thus it appears that a court case may be in the offing, but we cannot truthfully say this is certainty.

From Gailon,

"Add to this that we have reports from witnesses stating that the IRS took out several boxes of documents and have interviewed most of the financial office staff and several others in Administration..."

If what Fran says is true, it sounds like the IRS does plan to go to court--or whatever is the IRS equivalent--with this situation.

[Bob Pickle]

(I.e. Like Bob, I concluded that Appletree probably described an actual event with which he was familiar and that that event probably took place at 3ABN. However, that is my conclusion; it is not what he wrote.)

So our difference of opinion isn't too great.