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[Pat Williams]

So what is your version of truth that your claiming???
Your above post is almost presenting insinuations of the Dr??? or what BK discovered?

I don't have a version and am claiming nothing. I have questions. Anyman told you to find the truth. He's right, if you cared you would do that instead of accusing me of making the insinuations. I was just referring to the published letters from Barbara Kerr and her mother as were Johann, and anyman and asking about it all. The "insinuations" if that's what you want to call them, were in the letters. Johann claims to know all about it, but won't say, and  I don't see you asking him anything, or having any problems with that, only me. Interesting, huh?

Have you forgotten your implying that LS lost custody. You just did not present the real thing either.

There's that glitch of yours again.

I implied nothing, I quoted from Linda Shelton in a letter to Johann, who published it. Linda Shelton said she lost custody. Read it again please.  In contradiction to you claiming "You can't prove anything you say or answer unless you come up with "kool-aid" lingo." I provided the proof.

From:     Linda Shelton
To:     Johann Thorvaldsson
Subject:     Re: Greetings
Date:     Friday, April 16, 2004 4:18 PM


...
Nathan was just 15 when his father (who is not a Christian) took me to court to get custody of Nathan. Although the father had spent little time with Nathan during his childhood, Nathan was thrilled when all of a sudden he received special attention from him and the encouragement to move in with him. He promised lots of fishing and hunting time together. Making a long story short, I lost custody of Nathan. Less than a year later Nathan wanted to come home to live with us, but his father would not let him, and the law did not support him doing this

Wait a minute here...Don't you call yourself 3ABN Defender.  Do you know where you are coming from???

yes, and yes.

[ex3abnemployee]

I want to say that I do NOT hate Tommy Shelton, nor do I want to see him or his family destroyed.

X3,

To bad your once Christian position has been replaced with your current venom and glee about the current situation.

Glee? I am just stating a fact. You and 3d are desperately trying to distract everyone from what is going to happen next month. Trying to twist what I post isn't going to stop the trial, either.

Tinka and princessdi took this topic off course and brought up Linda, Nathan, etc... They were going back and forth about that first, and others can reply to what they post and claim.

Chastise them next time with your outrage and remind them, they need to be quiet as Tommy has a trial next month and nothing they say is going to stop it. As if we are even interested in doing that... Not. The courts are way more just and fair than you, Pickle, and your vindictive spiteful group are. I, myself, am glad Tommy has the opportunity to face his accusers, in an unbiased and just way, so put that in your pipe and smoke it.

AFAIC, you continue to look silly, petty, and deperate yourself with all your melodrama and accusations.

And you look ignorant and desperate when you keep trying to make this an anger issue. You are also still a coward.

[ex3abnemployee]

3D,
Your replies are glitched in your head. Not sure of anything you say is normal responses. You can't prove anything you say or answer unless you come up with "kool-aid" lingo.  I cannot imagine your responses of TS.  Your anger seems to be with Duane. what about the other victims too?? Let me tell you, the courts or jury is not going to have your sediments. Your sediments are your eternal glitch. Where is your proof of innocence? or are you waiting for pity to bestowed on this wretched human of evil deeds? Your pity should be for the wronged people.

So what is your version of truth that your claiming???
Your above post is almost presenting insinuations of the Dr??? or what BK discovered?

Have you forgotten your implying that LS lost custody. You just did not present the real thing either.

That's because I have a confession from Tommy, and they know it can't be refuted. They also know I can't be intimidated.

Now watch, someone is going to get on here and try to belittle the importance of the confession and my possible testimony about it.

[Pat Williams]

3D,
Your replies are glitched in your head. Not sure of anything you say is normal responses. You can't prove anything you say or answer unless you come up with "kool-aid" lingo.  I cannot imagine your responses of TS.  Your anger seems to be with Duane. what about the other victims too?? Let me tell you, the courts or jury is not going to have your sediments. Your sediments are your eternal glitch. Where is your proof of innocence? or are you waiting for pity to bestowed on this wretched human of evil deeds? Your pity should be for the wronged people.

So what is your version of truth that your claiming???
Your above post is almost presenting insinuations of the Dr??? or what BK discovered?

Have you forgotten your implying that LS lost custody. You just did not present the real thing either.

That's because I have a confession from Tommy, and they know it can't be refuted. They also know I can't be intimidated.

Now watch, someone is going to get on here and try to belittle the importance of the confession and my possible testimony about it.

You mean someone will get on here and point out that your unfortunate situation and "confession" has nothing to do with allegations of child molestation and nothing to do with the current and only case against, Tommy Shelton, and that you have no testimony or anything to contribute to it? If so, that's true, here I am.

Keep trying to sound important and swelling your chest out with pride here about that if that floats your boat though.

[ex3abnemployee]

LOL! I knew it.

Hey, when have I EVER said that I have anything to do with the current case? Answer: not one time. It's all of YOU defenders who are bringing that up. Also, I never said I was "molested." Again, that was YOUR side who brought that up.

Get this through your head. I am not afraid or intimidated by you or anyone else on your side. That old garbage may have worked for years with others, but it doesn't with me.

[Johann]

I was saying only Danny and Nathan can testify to their relationship and since no one here is going to take Danny's word about it (nor mine) then the best person to ask is Nathan as he is not going to lie about it.

Well, we managed to get a contact with Nathan, who has been under medical care after an accident at work, and tell him what has been said about him here. His first reaction was that what has been said about him here are not true.

In short:

You quoted a letter from Linda to Danny where she asked him if Nathan could stay with them for a couple of weeks after his return from Norway. Danny's reply was "NO" Danny did not want to have anything to do with Nathan. He was Linda's responsibility and not his. He did not want to see him at his house.

When did Nathan and Danny see each other last?

Two years ago Nathan was fishing in a lake when Danny happened to come by.

- Hi! said one of them

- Hi! said the other one.

Two years ago. That was it. Period.

I'm glad you say that Nathan is not going to lie about it. Where do the false rumors come from then?

[Pat Williams]

LOL! I knew it.

Hey, when have I EVER said that I have anything to do with the current case? Answer: not one time. It's all of YOU defenders who are bringing that up. Also, I never said I was "molested." Again, that was YOUR side who brought that up.

Get this through your head. I am not afraid or intimidated by you or anyone else on your side. That old garbage may have worked for years with others, but it doesn't with me.

No one I have seen is trying to make you afraid or intimidate you. I know I am not.

You are causing this situation yourself. If you didn't keep jumping into discussions about the court case, which is about allegations of child molestation and telling all that you have a "confession" and bringing up the importance of your "testimony" in the context of that, then no one would have to keep explaining and clarifying for others (who might be confused by your irelevant comments and claims) that:
1. You were not a victim or child molestation, and that you deny even being molested.
and
2. Your "testimony" and "confession" have nothing to do with the current case.

[Johann]

Tell us first about Barbara Kerr's encounter with Alyssa. Is that fair?

[Pat Williams]

I was saying only Danny and Nathan can testify to their relationship and since no one here is going to take Danny's word about it (nor mine) then the best person to ask is Nathan as he is not going to lie about it.

Well, we managed to get a contact with Nathan, who has been under medical care after an accident at work, and tell him what has been said about him here. His first reaction was that what has been said about him here are not true.

In short:

You quoted a letter from Linda to Danny where she asked him if Nathan could stay with them for a couple of weeks after his return from Norway. Danny's reply was "NO" Danny did not want to have anything to do with Nathan. He was Linda's responsibility and not his. He did not want to see him at his house.

When did Nathan and Danny see each other last?

Two years ago Nathan was fishing in a lake when Danny happened to come by.

- Hi! said one of them

- Hi! said the other one.

Two years ago. That was it. Period.

I'm glad you say that Nathan is not going to lie about it. Where do the false rumors come from then?

This isn't Nathan  here, it's you, Johann.

I flat out don't believe you, and this isn't the first time. 1.The apartments are 3ABN's for those taping shows, Board members  etc, not Danny's guest rooms. 2. Danny never said he didn't want anything to do with Nathan, get your facts straight, he didn't want Nathan's friends in his house, or any smoking or drinking there. 3. Nathan's doesn't want to be involved in your mess, and 4..I was in T-ville when Nathan was in town and visiting Danny, and other family members so I know better.

You must have talked to Linda, instead of Nathan, and are just parroting what you were told again.

[Johann]

This isn't Nathan  here, it's you, Johann.

How do you know it isn't Nathan?

I flat out don't believe you, and this isn't the first time.

Because you dare not face the facts.

1.The apartments are 3ABN's for those taping shows, Board members  etc, not Danny's guest rooms.

What do these apartments have to do with what we are talking about? Who are you trying to impress with completely irrelevant statements?

2. Danny never said he didn't want anything to do with Nathan, get your facts straight, he didn't want Nathan's friends in his house, or any smoking or drinking there.

This is from Nathan. He also made the statement before he left Norway - and that was not to Linda - that Danny did not want to have anything to do with him.

3. Nathan's doesn't want to be involved in your mess,

Whose mess? Are you referring to Danny?

4..I was in T-ville when Nathan was in town and visiting Danny, and other family members so I know better.

When did that take place? Nathan recalled only that incident by the lake two year ago.

You must have talked to Linda, instead of Nathan, and are just parroting what you were told again.

You have an interesting way of getting around the truth.

When I visited John Stanton in Springfield about five years ago I heard him parroting the false rumors created by Danny Shelton. He said he was assigned to be the pastor of that church to keep Linda from participating in the church program.

Now that he's gone the church members have not retained much of that parroting and they are inviting Linda back. They tell her he did not manage to impress them with his false accusations. Danny tries to the bitter end, but thank God there is an encounter with TRUTH where all the parroting will fail.




[/quote]

[anyman]

For your sake, and everybody else, it may pay to let things stay right there.

Excuse me? That comment more appropriately applies to you and Linda. You don't want the truth discovered revealed, it would cast doubt on everything you have claimed to this point.

But if you think it is important, why don't you say what you think happened there?

Unlike you (and others), I know when something is not mine to divulge. I also know that if I were to divulge the information you would immediately attempt to refute it and cast dispersions, muddying the waters. Bottom line, though, is that I do not have a right to speak for Barbara Kerr, only she can do that, that is her right.

[Sam]

3D,
Your replies are glitched in your head. Not sure of anything you say is normal responses. You can't prove anything you say or answer unless you come up with "kool-aid" lingo.  I cannot imagine your responses of TS.  Your anger seems to be with Duane. what about the other victims too?? Let me tell you, the courts or jury is not going to have your sediments. Your sediments are your eternal glitch. Where is your proof of innocence? or are you waiting for pity to bestowed on this wretched human of evil deeds? Your pity should be for the wronged people.

So what is your version of truth that your claiming???
Your above post is almost presenting insinuations of the Dr??? or what BK discovered?

Have you forgotten your implying that LS lost custody. You just did not present the real thing either.

Let me ease your mind on the subject of Nathan.  I knew Nathan well when he was growing up. I saw his relationship with his mother and his stepfather. But more important than what I saw is what I was told by Nathan himself.  He told me his mother didn't care about anything but being on TV and that Danny was the "way better" parent.  Why?  Because his mother never came to his football, basketball or baseball games.  In fact, I have seen him walking from the park after a practice because his mother dropped him off but failed to come back and get him. I know that is what happened since I stopped many times and gave him a ride home.  Danny on the other hand went to many of his games, took him fishing and did a lot of other activities with him. When he chose to live with his father instead of Linda he was required to spend several weeks of the summer with her.  One of those times when I gave him a ride he told me that he couldn't understand why he had to spend that time with her as all she did was go to work and be on TV. He said she never made any special time to be with him during those weeks and that he ended up just staying at home by himself all day or with Allyssa.  

Hearing all these things directly from Nathan is what made me so suspicious when his mother, all of a sudden, took this desperate interest in him that she had never shown before. So much so that she was willing to go to half way across the world to get him treatment?  I think not. I think she had another motive for going there and used Nathan as the excuse.  Especially since Nathan had been living with his grandmother for several years because Linda said she "couldn't deal with him". Eventually even his grandmother kicked him out...hence the discussion between Danny and Linda about him living in an apartment.  Did you get that?  Linda wasn't talking to Danny about coming home with her...she was asking if he could stay in an apartment. Could it be she still didn't want to deal with him after she used him to go to Norway.  How strange that Nathan had been on different drugs since he was a teenager but it wasn't until Linda met Arild that she decided to get him help.  There are lots of places in the US where she could have taken him but guess what?  Arild wasn't there.

So, there  you have it Tinka. Someone who has actually spoken to Nathan face to face. But, this isn't the "truth" that you wanted to hear so I have no doubt you will dismiss it.  Oh well, your opinion counts very little since, as you said, you don't know anyone involved and only repeat what you have read and been told.  Make no mistake...you will be held accountable for your slander and gossip as God doesn't take it lightly.

[Sam]

This isn't Nathan  here, it's you, Johann.

How do you know it isn't Nathan?

I flat out don't believe you, and this isn't the first time.

Because you dare not face the facts.

1.The apartments are 3ABN's for those taping shows, Board members  etc, not Danny's guest rooms.

What do these apartments have to do with what we are talking about? Who are you trying to impress with completely irrelevant statements?

2. Danny never said he didn't want anything to do with Nathan, get your facts straight, he didn't want Nathan's friends in his house, or any smoking or drinking there.

This is from Nathan. He also made the statement before he left Norway - and that was not to Linda - that Danny did not want to have anything to do with him.

3. Nathan's doesn't want to be involved in your mess,

Whose mess? Are you referring to Danny?

4..I was in T-ville when Nathan was in town and visiting Danny, and other family members so I know better.

When did that take place? Nathan recalled only that incident by the lake two year ago.

You must have talked to Linda, instead of Nathan, and are just parroting what you were told again.

You have an interesting way of getting around the truth.

When I visited John Stanton in Springfield about five years ago I heard him parroting the false rumors created by Danny Shelton. He said he was assigned to be the pastor of that church to keep Linda from participating in the church program.

Now that he's gone the church members have not retained much of that parroting and they are inviting Linda back. They tell her he did not manage to impress them with his false accusations. Danny tries to the bitter end, but thank God there is an encounter with TRUTH where all the parroting will fail.

[/quote


Johann you know better...John Stanton was hired by the Seventh Day Adventist Conference to take over the church in springfield. His going there had nothing to do with Linda. In fact, it would have been much easier on him, I'm sure, if she wasn't a member there. The conference hired him, sent him there and paid his salary. This had absolutely nothing to do with 3abn. With you being a retired pastor you know how it works when the conference sends you somewhere so why lie about it or believe Linda's lies?

[ex3abnemployee]

Another note to the defenders: Crucifying Nathan won't stop the trial, either.

[princessdi]

Wow!! Was this a busy thread since yeaterday!  Ok for the most part, I am out of this one.  I realy have no dog in this fight, and can see the issues on both sides.

The one thing that does bother me is how 3D, Anyman, and whoever else can continue to defend TS criminal and immoral activities.  To my thinking, you all should not have much to say about it.  The man is being criminally prosecuted for what you all claimed not to be true all this time.

Also, Duane can want to see TS brought to justice for his crimes without hating him.  [If] TS did the crimes, then he must do the time.  That is justice and has nothing to do with how we feel about a person.  I say that, but you all know that I also get at the supporters of this site who demonize DS with every post, when he is only another child of God with issues...........like the rest of us.  

We have real problems here seeing the "opposing" group through the eyes of God.  We make humanize their faults and sins, and miss the hurting person.  Both sides need to do better if each of you is going to claim that God is on
your side.