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[Bob Pickle]

First of all, Bob, you can't judge and don't know the status of Clinton's relationship with God.

Feel free to quote anything from anywhere that demonstrates that Clinton's confession was different than Achan's.

David only confessed when he had to, didn't he?  Nathan had to come and tell him aobut himself, did he not?

Apples and oranges. Samuel came and told Saul he'd done wrong. Saul denied it. Nathan told David he'd done wrong. David owned up immediately. Further, David immediately started fasting and praying on the ground. Then he enshrined his confession and repentance in the national hymnal.

Once again, you are holding someone to hire standard that even God requires.....

Not at all. Rather, I am pointing out what God's standard is.

We really have to be careful about the vanishing line between church and state.  Our own end time prophecy is dependent on the fact that this will take place, and we should be aware.  We have not only not been aware, we have been helping to erase it, speeding up the evitable.  We should stop trying to hold our political leaders accountable to our religious standards.  Since they are serving many of many different religious beliefs, which standard she they uphold, all are not the same, right?

What religious standards are you referring to? Honesty? Morality?

I need to clarify this.  No, you did not say that Clinton's presidency was a dismal failure, but it is the ultimate and logical conclusion to your reasoning.

I will say that Clinton as president dismally failed as a role model to our children when he did what he did and lied about it under oath.

Since he could and was trustworthy in his presidency, while at the very same time not being trustworthy in his marriage(and had been since being gov of AR), your question is not valid.

How do you know that he was trustworthy in his presidency? Because he said so? How would you know unless you had an extra high security clearance during his administration?

[Bob Pickle]

Here's what I believe is one forgotten standard ordained by God that every public official should adhere to:

The guardians of the people, men in authority, upon whose decisions hang the lives of their fellow-creatures, should be subject to severe punishment if found guilty of intemperance. Those who enforce laws should be lawkeepers. They should be men of self-government, in full harmony with the laws governing their physical, mental, and moral powers, that they may possess full vigor of intellect and a high sense of justice. (2SP 80)

The context is the wrongful death of John the Baptist, slain because those who held his life in their hands were tipsy.

Does "severe punishment" refer to simply removal from office, or something more stern?

[Bob Pickle]

Christian leadership has a different set of standards than politics and business. Christian leaders are to set a Biblical example of living according to Christian principles. A politician can be immoral without breaking the law and still do a good job of governing as long as the voters don't mind, but being moral is a part of the Biblical job description in Christian leadership even when the laws of the land havent been broken.

Consider:

By working upon the jealousy of the kings and the ruling classes, Rome had influenced them to keep the people in bondage, well knowing that the state would thus be weakened, and purposing by this means to fasten both rulers and people in her thrall. With farsighted policy she perceived that in order to enslave men effectually, the shackles must be bound upon their souls; that the surest way to prevent them from escaping their bondage was to render them incapable of freedom. A thousandfold more terrible than the physical suffering which resulted from her policy, was the moral degradation. Deprived of the Bible, and abandoned to the teachings of bigotry and selfishness, the people were shrouded in ignorance and superstition, and sunken in vice, so that they were wholly unfitted for self-government. (GC 281)

What effect will it have upon our nation if we are sunken in vice, if we elect people who are sunken in vice, and if we idolize those who are sunken in vice? At what point do we thus become wholly unfit for self-government?

[tinka]

[

What effect will it have upon our nation if we are sunken in vice, if we elect people who are sunken in vice, and if we idolize those who are sunken in vice? At what point do we thus become wholly unfit for self-government?
[/quote]

The effect is why we are exactly where we are at now in America. all right is wrong and all wrong is right in the eyes of the evil. The effect of this shows not only on our nation but posters as they ok theft, self exaltion, misuse and abuse of money, criminal behavior, lying, and deceivement. Can any of the sympathizers please tell me with an oath to God that this did not happen with the pew money? How can you hide it?

66:17   They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves.......  shall be consumed together, saith the LORD. 
  66:18   For I [know] their works and their thoughts: .........

[princessdi]

Apples and oranges. Samuel came and told Saul he'd done wrong. Saul denied it. Nathan told David he'd done wrong. David owned up immediately. Further, David immediately started fasting and praying on the ground. Then he enshrined his confession and repentance in the national hymnal.

Samething, Bob.  Saul is apples and oranges.  David still did not admit his wrong until he was caught. You siad Clinton didn't admit his worng until he had ot.  David did the very same thing.

What religious standards are you referring to? Honesty? Morality?

Exactly.  You can't expect his to be the same as yours, or as those upheld in your denom. 

I will say that Clinton as president dismally failed as a role model to our children when he did what he did and lied about it under oath.

He is not supposed to be a role model for our children, but if he is, like our current Commander and Chief, it is a huge plus.  Next to Jesus, we ought to be our children's role model.

How do you know that he was trustworthy in his presidency? Because he said so? How would you know unless you had an extra high security clearance during his administration?

Maybe because, unlike now, most of the countries of the world did not hate us, trusted us, looked up to us..........that might have been a good indication. You know, you shal know them by their fruit........ Part of the huge job President Obama has in front of him is to rebuild our credibility in the world.

Come on, Bob, this can't be that difficult for you to understand.

[tinka]

Maybe because, unlike now, most of the countries of the world did not hate us, trusted us, looked up to us..........that might have been a good indication. You know, you shal know them by their fruit........ Part of the huge job President Obama has in front of him is to rebuild our credibility in the world.

Come on, Bob, this can't be that difficult for you to understand.
[/quote)

Princess Di

Evidently it is you that does not understand or you would not be doing this much effort to convince the wrong side of things Maybe you need to read a little more about the situation the world is in where past presidents have sanctified their own doing. Bush made mistakes that the left like to dwell on but his morals were no where what Clinton's was. Clinton was a hand out president and you must agree with that. So here we are just like the prophecy below.


Subject: GN: The Coming Civil War! - Ron Ewart

http://www.federalobserver.com/blog/2009/01/25/the-coming-civil-war/#more-547

The Coming Civil War!
January 25, 2009 - If you are a hard-working, responsible, self-reliant and successful American, how do you like billions of your taxes paying for bank, business and ner-do-well homebuyer bailouts, homebuyers that were encouraged by government to buy homes they couldn’t afford.  How do you like your government using trillions of your tax dollars for ill advised stimulus packages that won’t and aren’t working?

How do you like paying for education, health care, housing and safety-net benefits for illegal aliens that are streaming into America by the millions?  How do you like our open border policy and the lack of enforcement of existing laws that have become the magnet for those millions to come here in the first place?  And how do you like the fact that politicians in both parties purposely allow these things to happen, for the sole purpose of increasing their base of future voters?  To make matters worse, under the current regime, (socialist administration) amnesty for illegals is coming our way very soon, no matter how most Americans will object.  After all, these politicians know what is best for us, don’t they?

How do you like individuals being appointed by the new president to become Secretary of the Treasury, who will oversee the IRS, when the appointee has cheated on his income tax, hired illegal aliens as house keepers and some other little misdeeds he was purported to have committed?  How do you like an individual (Holder) with an avowed mindset against individual gun ownership, being appointed to the top American Justice official, attorney general of the United States?

How do you like your tax dollars being used in foreign aid, that is given to dictators, despots and other cretins who use our money for their own enrichment and trickle only a few of our dollars to their “subjects”?  Did you know that your current socialist president is now pushing for 0.7% of our Gross Domestic Product (GDP - $14 Trillion) to be paid out in foreign aid, because that is what the United Nations says is the fair amount for America?  Did you know that 0.7% of GDP is just shy of $100,000,000,000 (billion) dollars of our tax money going offshore, and for what?  This is nothing more than government forcing you to be charitable to the entire world, at the point of a gun.  (Don’t think so?  Try not paying your taxes.)

National Health Care is coming whether we like it our not.  Did you know that Obama’s current stimulus package of almost $1 Trillion dollars, sets aside $600,000,000 to prepare for National Health Care?  If they are spending this kind of money for preparation, you can bet we will get National Health Care.

How do you like government telling you what to eat, what to wear, where to live, where to work, what to drive, or being forced to not drive at all and paying for government mega-projects that always come with huge cost overruns, where they have to go back to the taxpayer for more money to finish the project?  Happens every time.  Government is the epitome of waste, fraud, abuse and corruption.

How do you like your government telling you that you have to get off of oil, drive your car less and decrease your carbon foot print to save us from the dire predictions of the fraud that is man-caused global warming?  How will you like the cost of everything increasing because of government’s headlong drive to decrease man-caused CO2 emissions and engage in the insanity of cap and trade policies?  How do you like your government telling you that you have to subsidize highly inefficient wind and solar power, that is but a small fraction of what oil and coal produce?  How do you like the fact that environmentalists and government have stood in the way of clean nuclear energy for 30 years?

How do you like government telling you what you can or cannot do with your land?  And you rural landowners, how do you feel about being asked to bear almost the entire burden of environmental protection, while your city brethren get off virtually scot-free?   These same city folks who have the majority votes to elect the politicians that pass the environmental laws that only affect rural landowners.  That’s fair, isn’t it?  No it isn’t fair and in fact, violates the equal protection clause of the constitution.

How do you like your federal government sticking their fingers into local public schools and mandating, with federal law, socialism, radical environmentalism, multi-culturalism and the one-world-order being taught to your children in those schools?  How do you like the fact that the federal government prints the books that teach our children about our form of government, but those books teach that our form of government is a Constitutional Democracy, not a Constitutional Republic?  The distinctions between a Democracy and a Republic are a canyon wide.  Does brainwashing and indoctrination come to mind?

How do you like the fact that the injustices that were being inflicted on the colonials in 1776, that caused them to revolt against the tyrannical rule of England, are now the very same injustices Americans are being accosted with, by their own government, for the last 80 to 100 years?  How do you like the fact that under the current Obama administration and a very liberal congress, those injustices will increase at an accelerated rate?

The giant question is, how long will freedom-loving Americans take it?  How long will the producers put up with paying for the non-producers and outright billion-dollar gifts in foreign aid?  How long will those brave Americans who are embedded with the song of liberty, take the theft of their sweat, blood and tears, before they say, enough is enough?  Which of the injustices we are now enduring, will be the trigger that will send a large percentage of these Americans over the edge and declare civil war against the non-producers, who leverage government with their majority vote, to fill their government-sponsored “pig trough”?  Or, how long will it be before the producers of our society, either “check out”, or declare war on their own government for these injustices?

The current direction of America will and is producing mediocrity, self-loathing and a decline in production and morality.  These cultural maladies will only get worse on this path we take.

Predictions of future events is a dicey game.  Many have tried but predictions, throughout history, turn out to be mostly inaccurate ….. the Mayans, Nostradamus and a few others given marginal credit.  But we will take a stab at some general predictions.  The hard truth is, we are headed for a civil war.  Nevertheless, rest assured, this will not be the civil war of 1861, wherein brother rises up against brother and state declares war against another state or states.  This war won’t be fought with larger-than-life generals, unless nationwide anarchy ensues.

As the liberals in the current administration squeeze Americans with their socialist, radical environmental and one-world-order agenda, as they work towards dismantling American sovereignty, even more so than previous administrations have done, small armed revolts will begin to appear in isolated areas.  These small revolts will be immediately squashed by local law enforcement.  Even so, the small revolts will grow and become larger ones.  There will be individual attacks on other individuals for perceived threats or revenge for acts of violence.  Occasions of Hatfield and McCoy feuds will grow.   There will be attacks by individuals on government institutions, as more and more folks let their growing frustrations morph into violent acts.  There will be individual and multiple violent attacks on illegal aliens.

Still, other non-violent revolts will come in the form of silent and noisy protests.  Some revolts will come in the form of disobeying the law and withholding taxes.  These are already happening.  Some will come in the form of increased lobbying of politicians and rising numbers of court cases to undo what the liberals have and are doing.  But even worse, some will come in the form of wholesale cheating.  The prevailing attitude will be, if the government can cheat, abuse our trust and their power and corrupt our institutions, why should individual Americans be any different?  A breakdown in morality, honesty, integrity and honor will accelerate.  This breakdown is already well underway.

Large infusions of borrowed or printed dollars for government stimulus packages and outright handouts, will accelerate inflation and/or end up in hyper inflation.  This will lead to rising hunger as it takes more dollars to buy the necessities of life.  Rising hunger will trigger more government intervention and the requirement for more taxes.  Taxes will rise accordingly.  More banks will fail.  A deep depression could be just around the corner.

In some of these occurrences, the government will declare martial law and they will suspend constitutional protections, like Habeas Corpus, as did President Lincoln did during the Civil War.

All these things will come to pass in one form or another, because “We The People” have allowed government to become all powerful and corrupt and this corruption has infected a large percentage of the American population.  Should we not return to the principles of our constitution, should we not re-claim our morality, and soon, as a country and as a free society we are doomed to fail and ultimate disintegration.  If were trying to fail, we are doing an excellent job.

In spite of these dire predictions, there is still time to save America, if only the millions of Americans who cherish freedom, will rise up individually and collectively and get involved in the hard work of preserving, protecting and defending our constitution and giving aid and comfort to those organizations that are working valiantly on their behalf. 
© Copyright January 26, 2009 - All Rights Reserved

~ The Author ~
 Ron Ewart is the President of The National Association of Rural Landowners and may reached for comment via email at r.ewart@comcast.net .

The Ron Ewart Archive on The Federal Observer

[Bob Pickle]

Samething, Bob.  Saul is apples and oranges.  David still did not admit his wrong until he was caught. You siad Clinton didn't admit his worng until he had ot.  David did the very same thing.

Close. But if Clinton had admitted his wrong when he got caught like David did, he never would have lied under oath. When questioned, Clinton lied. We have no record that David did such in the matter of Bathsheba. David confessed even though no one produced a dress.

What religious standards are you referring to? Honesty? Morality?

Exactly.  You can't expect his to be the same as yours, or as those upheld in your denom.

 

Honesty and morality are civil standards, not religious standards. If I said I expect our leaders not to murder people, would you say I was violating the spearation of church and state and imposing my religious beliefs on them?

He is not supposed to be a role model for our children, but if he is, like our current Commander and Chief, it is a huge plus.  Next to Jesus, we ought to be our children's role model.

Every president of the United States IS a role model, whether he likes it or not.

How do you know that he was trustworthy in his presidency? Because he said so? How would you know unless you had an extra high security clearance during his administration?

Maybe because, unlike now, most of the countries of the world did not hate us, trusted us, looked up to us..........that might have been a good indication.

And how do you know that Clinton was responsible for those things?

Seems to me that at the time folks said his administration should have known Pakistan and India were about to blow nuclear bombs.

Recall how folks weren't too happy that Clinton ordered the bombing of a pharmaceutical company.

[princessdi]

I am just going to answer the last two posts in one fell swoop.  Tinka, if I even start to try to answer that "article" it will take forever.  It really doesn't matter how we got here now, and there is enough blame to go around here. Fact is, are we are here, and the issues need to be taken care of, because ALL the areas addressed in the article are intermingled and will have a more severe domino effect.
 
Examples:  Those who are losing thie homes to foreclosure live in neighborhoods and it doesn't take very many foreclosures in a neighborhood to have a direct undesirable effect on the value of the rest of the houses in that neighborhood.  So yes, you do want to help them keep their homes.  You might need for your home's value to be in tact sooner than you think.  What I find missing in articles as you are posted, Tinks, is the lack of understanding of the word community.  What effects your neighbor will effect you, eventually.  That is not just political, or even just financial, but biblical.

Yes, we have to help the auto industry, their workers(all hardworking, self-reliant, successful Americans) also live in neighborhoods and in towns and work and own the small businesses(all hardworking, self-reliant, successful Americans) that sprung up around those factories.  So we don't help them and they lay off almost everybody, which may mean not only home foreclosures, but businesses(the glass and metal factories that supply the auto makers, the owner of the snack truck that comes around at breakfast and lunch) and towns(Mom and Pop stores, gas stations, schools) drying up.  Then you get even into big business because what about the Walmart, grocery store, mall in the area, etc.....

I could go on, but you get my meaning....

I think we forget that we are democracy and what that means.  "A government by the people, for the people.  It is our taxes which fund the democracy.  At this point, it is "the people's" problem and "the people" need to solve it while putting in place safeguards so we don't end up here again. 

I didn't say that Clinton's administration was perfect, neither did I condone his wrong doing.  There are clearing things which began, or had their origins in Clinton's, and even Daddy Bush's administrations that only came to fruition in GWB's time.  Especially, in the area of finance. That is common sense.  However, Clinton left us in a much better condition than we are in now--Bush's watch).  Whatever happened, happened on his watch, good, bad or indifferent...the same with Bush.  While Clinton was in office,  when he left office, we had good relations with most countries.............While Bush is in office,
when he leaves office, our reputation is trash and people are rejoicing in the streets.......worldwide....as he leaves office.......remember............his watch...............good, bad or indifferent.

What I realize most of all, is who I am actually addressing in this situation.  None of you will always see Clinton's administration as tainted by his error, no matter how the rest of his presidency went.  Your party talked about "family values" and Clinton's lack thereof.............until Obama came and lived those values, and then there was not another word said.  Now, it is a cinch that we will never see eye to eye on this subject for many different reasons(most of which will start threads on their own).  I am in no mood to break it all down to you, and you all are in no position to hear or admit the full and entire truth   I have stated my position and you have stated yours.  Time to move on....people.

[tinka]

Princess di
I understand fully how and why you take a stand that you do. Like I have said before, I have black friends that are intelligent in the political field that can handle your way of thinking and do a lot better then me in this debate of what is right and what is wrong. They also do not separate themselves by race but have educated themselves in just being American which banishes the prejudice. It is why and how the black vote came into play as they refuse to banish race. I would have voted for Condi Rice in a moment and she is very intelligent and felt secure with her. But never Obama, and oh by the way, thought you would like to hear the latest in the big money deal. Guess he owes them!!! Right here is the difference of how this election went as it was premediatated from a few years back on just how they Planned to win. The story goes that an honest person never suspects the evil until it is already done. So now America will have what they have been deceived into getting. Mark my words time will make you repent-- as like Pharoah was used for God's purpose so will it be. Tell me and make me believe we are going to live now high on hog until Jesus comes because of this new so called messiah. You are so mistaken.

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[Bob Pickle]

Your party talked about "family values" ....

I think the first two words indicate what the problem is. When I said:

I don't want anyone in government who do such despicable things, whether the alleged victim be male or female.

If their sense of morality is that low, I don't think they can be trusted in a position of responsibility.

As an example: If Bill Clinton couldn't be true to the vow he took at the marriage altar, what made anyone think that he would be true to the oath of office he took?

When I said that I wasn't talking about one party or another. I am not a member of any political party. I simply think that we shouldn't have people in the highest offices in our land who have sold their souls for vice or greed or anything else that will cause them to choose wrong over right when decisions must be made. It has nothing to do with parties.

If you have a drug addict in the house and money is missing from your purse and they say they didn't do it, can you believe them? Not at all.

We need people in high positions who are as true to duty as the needle to the pole, who vow to their own hurt and change not. And someone who has sold their soul for lust doesn't qualify.

Problem is, the kind of people we need are pretty rare today. It's a sign of the end.

By the way, simply calling for religious leaders doesn't do it. Wily politicians simply get "religious." That brings religion down rather than the state up, and is what led to the spiritual declension just before the Millerite Movement took place. The number of Republicans who have had their own moral difficulties suggests that 170 years hasn't changed things much in that regard.

[princessdi]

Your black friends can be of the same state of mind you are if they want.  There were always some blacks of the same mind of the slave traders, slave masters, etc.  The presences of blacks in ones life doesn't make anyone any less racist. There are black republicans.  That is life.  Everyone gets a choice.  

The republican point of view is one who doesn't recognize the sense of community and helping others, even if once they were among those who needed help.  The hidden message in the phrase "giveaway president" is that they are going to assist people who republican deem unworthy of that assistance.  That is mostly based on race, but also can be almost equally based on class. There are black people with this state of mind.  Quite of few of them, but definitely not all, manifesting some type of self[race] hatred. Sure there are gliches in the systems put in place meant to help those most in need, but you don't throw out the baby with the bath water.  You tighten up the process, and not leave those in need out in the cold.  

Tinka, I promise you if there was any hint of scandal in Mr. Obama's past, present, or eve a hint in the future, he would not even been allowed to run for president.  Just one of Sarah Palin's issues would have knock ehim(and any other candidate) out of the race.  He had to be squeaky clean, including being held responsible for the words of others.  Gurl please, tell that stuff to somebody who doesn't know any better.

And just for the record, i would not have voted for Condi, just as I didnt' vote for Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton when they ran.  Condi, well I dont' agree with her politics, Jesse and Al were not good candidates, period.  I did not vote for Obama because he was black, if I didnt' like what he was saying, I still would not have voted for him, black or not.  For the record, also, he even emphasized that he wasn't running as a black candidate but an American Candidate, so your black friends should not have a problem with him.  

I know that is it pretty scary that black people did finally mobilized themselve and acted in unity.  You all have been afraid of that since we were slaves.  There is nothing begative about that. It does not make us prejudce.  We happen ot have voted for a man who insists on including everyone at the table. He has not gotten into office and appointed all blacks, or excluding whites.  He is insisting on everyone being included.  Now, I will tell you that many blacks do feel as though he ought to take a little revenge, but you know I tell them different, especially if they are christians.  Two wrongs never make a right, and vengance belongs to God He allowed those men to be president because he sets up kingdoms and takes them down.  Out of our relationship to Him, we owe them the respect of that office.

Sure, a good portion of past administrations not only excluded blacks but seemingly intentionally took every opportunity to impede any progress.  We put up with that for 43 preseidents.  Now, we get 1, one, one black president in 200+ year history of this country and you and your black friends can find a problem with it.  What is wrong with this pricture?

One more thing.....if there was realy anything to that "article" you posted, I am sure that FOXNEWS would have picked up on it by now.  Soory, gurl, not working............you might want to come out of De Nial and.......pray that God will really show you your heart...............now, I am through with this, also.  Going around in racist circles is extremely tiresome.  There is nothing I can do for you or your blakc friends.  Only God can changed hearts, and only then if He is allowed, as He won't force you.

[princessdi]

Sorry about that, Bob, I did mean to changed that before posting. I meant to say "the reublican party".

Our religious leaders don't need to be religious....at least at work they don't.  What they do in their private lives in quite another thing.  However, in a true relationship with Christ, it will "show" where ever they are...................right?  However, it should not be a requirement of the job.

Your party talked about "family values" ....

I think the first two words indicate what the problem is. When I said:

I don't want anyone in government who do such despicable things, whether the alleged victim be male or female.

If their sense of morality is that low, I don't think they can be trusted in a position of responsibility.

As an example: If Bill Clinton couldn't be true to the vow he took at the marriage altar, what made anyone think that he would be true to the oath of office he took?

When I said that I wasn't talking about one party or another. I am not a member of any political party. I simply think that we shouldn't have people in the highest offices in our land who have sold their souls for vice or greed or anything else that will cause them to choose wrong over right when decisions must be made. It has nothing to do with parties.

If you have a drug addict in the house and money is missing from your purse and they say they didn't do it, can you believe them? Not at all.

We need people in high positions who are as true to duty as the needle to the pole, who vow to their own hurt and change not. And someone who has sold their soul for lust doesn't qualify.

Problem is, the kind of people we need are pretty rare today. It's a sign of the end.

By the way, simply calling for religious leaders doesn't do it. Wily politicians simply get "religious." That brings religion down rather than the state up, and is what led to the spiritual declension just before the Millerite Movement took place. The number of Republicans who have had their own moral difficulties suggests that 170 years hasn't changed things much in that regard.

[tinka]

Your black friends can be of the same state of mind you are if they want.

 There were always some blacks of the same mind of the slave traders, slave masters, etc.  

Out of your own mouth comes the crux of your confusion.

First, In every race there are some smarter then others. 2nd, Your ancestors were slaves. Yes, over 100 years ago. Were you a slave? NO. Did your  parents or ancestors fight states rights? yes. Did the win? yes.  Did whites fight for you? yes  Did you have to fight it? NO. Did Republicans fight for race? yes! Have you studied to see what Democrats actually did to you? The way I see it. No! Do they help you now or deceive and use you to keep some blacks where they are? Yes! It takes a little study to see how they do that!   It is over. But for the revenger's it is not! (3.)  White Christian ancestors were burned at the stake over a 100 years ago. Did that happen likewise in our generation?  NO. Did black and white fight for the freedom of rights and religious freedom in ww1 and ww2 yes  4. Were the Jews slaves in past generations? Yes. Do they use that for racism now? No. 5. The smart blacks realized back then and now that all men are equal and go on with their meek and mild spirits of trying to be useful in society under belief in God in where ever he puts us in all situations and races. That is where the education and smarts end for these people that think they have to take up the plight for their ancestors. A true Christian makes no difference in the color of skin. It is not us making the difference any longer. Many, Many white people have worked for equality and you just do not let it happen. That is the black problem. My friends realize that and people like you don't. The racism comes not from white in this year and this time like the ancestors. We live now and now is not then and EGW states that prejudice will probably not end until the end and that is because Satan uses it as a tool now and in the past. The past belongs in the past.  Even EGW understood and some of her money she sent to help the black pastors.  So when you can forget the color you will get well.
The presences of blacks in ones life doesn't make anyone any less racist. There are black republicans.  That is life.  Everyone gets a choice.  

Yes they do, If they understand it in a Christian way. Most do not get past the past and that nails them into no unity.

The republican point of view is one who doesn't recognize the sense of community and helping others, even if once they were among those who needed help.  

It is obvious that you believe others should work for you or others when they won't work for themselves.

The Republican point of view is Bibical. But all republicans are not Christians but their view is based on

 65:22   They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree [are] the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.

14:7   For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always. 

This last phrase brings this help down to individuality for God to judge. This does not say poor blacks or poor whites. God will judge us on individual basis on how we gave to help. How his people the church respond NOT THE GOVERNMENT.  Nowhere does this say that America will be judged as a Nation on how they gave through forceful government that forced the people to give until they were made to be in the majority of the poor. The poor forced, giving to the poor. Think about it.

Democrats view is not Bibical. The above verse is telling you how it should have been.

The hidden message in the phrase "giveaway president" is that they are going to assist people who republican deem unworthy of that assistance.  

Here is where I draw the line on lack of Bibical knowledge as we are instructed. I agree that many are not concerned to take a stand on any party but this is the reason I do. I am part of society, part of a country, protected by the sacrifice of men and women that I am proud of in the past years and this is why I believe that some low taxes are ok to help society for roads, and upkeep of a nation, just like the upkeep of church. I live here and will not under any conditions make the soldiers of freedom that died and I walk upon the earth of their dust change the Bibical view of what they fought for. I have no time to convince closed uneducated views of racism in the hearts of ones that keep it going and give up all reason just to put a certain race in office. Now that is ludicrous.

That is mostly based on race, but also can be almost equally based on class. There are black people with this state of mind.  Quite of few of them, but definitely not all, manifesting some type of self[race] hatred. Sure there are gliches in the systems put in place meant to help those most in need, but you don't throw out the baby with the bath water.  You tighten up the process, and not leave those in need out in the cold.  

You cannot tighten up the process when you do not go by the correct rules.

Tinka, I promise you if there was any hint of scandal in Mr. Obama's past, present, or eve a hint in the future, he would not even been allowed to run for president.  

Where have you been? I look at the facts just like the facts I have seen on DS Saga. Are you blind to that too?
Just one of Sarah Palin's issues would have knock ehim(and any other candidate) out of the race.  He had to be squeaky clean, including being held responsible for the words of others.  Gurl please, tell that stuff to somebody who doesn't know any better.

He is not squeaky clean? He is brilliant to premeditation of fraud!

And just for the record, i would not have voted for Condi, just as I didnt' vote for Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton when they ran.  Condi, well I dont' agree with her

Her education must have intimidated you!

politics, Jesse and Al were not good candidates, period.  I did not vote for Obama because he was black,

Then you voted for the handouts that will eventually bring America down like you stated. 

if I didnt' like what he was saying, I still would not have voted for him, black or not.  For the record, also, he even emphasized that he wasn't running as a black candidate but an American Candidate, so your black friends should not have a problem with him.  

I know that is it pretty scary that black people did finally mobilized themselve and acted in unity. Yes they did, under Acorn

 You all have been afraid of that since we were slaves. You and these late generation were never a slave and now you have the point.

 There is nothing begative about that. It does not make us prejudce. Your statement above does exactly that 

We happen ot have voted for a man who insists on including everyone at the table. He has not gotten into office and appointed all blacks, or excluding whites.  He is insisting on everyone being included.  Now, I will tell you that many blacks do feel as though he ought to take a little revenge, that is exactly my point, you made my case right here and now! They have been trained by parents of the same view like you

but you know I tell them different, especially if they are Christians.  Two wrongs never make a right, and vengance belongs to God He allowed those men to be president because he sets up kingdoms and takes them down.  Out of our relationship to Him, we owe them the respect of that office.

Sure, a good portion of past administrations not only excluded blacks but seemingly intentionally took every opportunity to impede any progress.  We put up with that for 43 preseidents.  Now, we get 1, one, one black president in 200+ year history of this country and you and your black friends can find a problem with it.  What is wrong with this pricture?

We find a problem how it was obtained as stated above

One more thing.....if there was realy anything to that "article" you posted, I am sure that FOXNEWS would have picked up on it by now. They have and much more. 

Soory, gurl, not working............you might want to come out of De Nial and an other point,  seems you do not except the American English language either
. .......pray that God will really show you your heart...............now, I am through with this, also.  Going around in racist circles is extremely tiresome. You just do not know what causes it and that is too bad.  There is nothing I can do for you or your blakc friends. That is ok as they are just normal, educated Americans and we converse in unity and comfortability, respect and love. Only God can changed hearts, and only then if He is allowed, as He won't force you.

I just want to say one more thing, when I first came on here I saw somewhere the worst posting of horrible same language coming from BSDA talk that I think I ever heard out of someone by the name of I want to say "Leon" but no maybe that is not the name. If not Leon do not take offense. It was absolutely appalling, I would have to go back an make sure but I would know it if I heard it again. It has slipped my mind but that is an example of why there is racism.

[childoftheking]

Tinka

1. Surely you and others who may have taken offense at non standard English know that English is an evolving language which borrows words and phrases from cultures other than the WASP culture. Every year words and phrases are added to the dictionary as they change from popular usage to standard and accepted. Many blacks and whites who use slang are educated people who knowingly use it to make a point. You don't get the point when you don't realize you or your point of view are being gently mocked. Those who think they are superior because they don't use that kind of talk may not realize that they are the ones who are being condescended to.

2. The political discussion here has become very heated. Whatever group or political party anyone chooses to be the self appointed spokesman for on either or any side will find members of that group that have differing opinions. Just because one disagrees with a personal point of view or even disagrees with the most popular point of view within each group does not make them sellouts, bad people, bigots, immoral or deceived. Most people are firmly convinced that their point of view is the truth and get very upset when it is challenged. I believe that only when we get to heaven (assuming that we do) will we find out what went on behind the scenes. Man looks on the outward appearance. Only God looks on the heart. I think we are all a little biased. Myself included. I apologize for my own prejudices which it will probably take a lifetime to overcome. Help me. Tinka, may I assume that you are a relative newcomer to this part of the world or that your parents were? Do you like people to be prejudiced against people from your background?

[tinka]

Tinka

1. Surely you and others who may have taken offense at non standard English know that English is an evolving language which borrows words and phrases from cultures other than the WASP culture. Every year words and phrases are added to the dictionary as they change from popular usage to standard and accepted. Many blacks and whites who use slang are educated people who knowingly use it to make a point. You don't get the point when you don't realize you or your point of view are being gently mocked. Those who think they are superior because they don't use that kind of talk may not realize that they are the ones who are being condescended to.

Childoftheking,
I also see slang used to downgrade the Holy Scriptures in new versions. Instead of bringing ourselves up to meet and understand the higher standards there is always people to bring down the standards to their lever that people will follow.  To believe that look at the dress of America and what it has become to accomodate to the lower levels and bring down the standards that cause one to santify all that they do is the right of things. It has taken me a life time to see that fact. I am not a follower of man and his slang in many things. What in this world are we instructed to do other then reach higher levels of education and knowledge in God's way? In mannerism, dress, health, and speaking? It does not matter to me if someone is mocking me.

2. The political discussion here has become very heated. Whatever group or political party anyone chooses to be the self appointed spokesman for on either or any side will find members of that group that have differing opinions. Just because one disagrees with a personal point of view or even disagrees with the most popular point of view within each group does not make them sellouts, bad people, bigots, immoral or deceived. Most people are firmly convinced that their point of view is the truth and get very upset when it is challenged. I believe that only when we get to heaven (assuming that we do) will we find out what went on behind the scenes. Man looks on the outward appearance. Only God looks on the heart. I think we are all a little biased. Myself included. I apologize for my own prejudices which it will probably take a lifetime to overcome. Help me. Tinka, may I assume that you are a relative newcomer to this part of the world or that your parents were? Do you like people to be prejudiced against people from your background?

You have misunderstood or I was not clear in my point. Prejudice is a tool of Satan. I was simply stating that other groups of race does not have the venum that is still with in "revenge" word that Princess di stated and I commented on.

Also the level of ones character can never be upgraded without a knowledge of true facts Bibically and Politically. I simply in a long way stated that with out Biblical principles you cannot know Political principles.  Our obligation is to inquire of Holy Spirit and then do our part to learn with an open mind and leave prejudice behind.