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[tinka]

Bonnie,
I thought I posted back to you but guess it did not work I hope I am not doing this again and the post is somewhere I cannot find. I do not even know if I am in the right spot but thought it was important to reply, I can't find where you were and left out at but I do remember what you said and would like to answer your question of using the funds of "little abused people".
 Here is the deal as I see it. Not that it matters except if it is right in the sight of God.

I see it is of no concern the personal lives of Bob, Galion, or even DS. As no one has complete control what happens in their persoal lives. What really is of concern in the 3abn saga is the "misuse and abuse" of the decieved givers of funds to DS and then let his personal life come in play to gain the assests to himself and therefore away from Linda and known victims. Bob and Gallon's personal life had nothing to do with 3abn's misuse of funds.  I really do not care how it is stopped whether it be by News media, Bob, Gallon, or some powerful person. I would not have cared how or who if someone would have stood up for us They took our money, land and business all to the tune of greed and political use. Right is right and truth is truth. I want you to remember one thing. No one stood up for Jesus at the trial! But he was right.
Now, this is how I feel about the matter

As far as letting those "little abused people" to put up the funds. I guess I would rather see the funds used to clean up the mess instead of DS using it for extravaganza and personal ego and entertainment. I am not sure about answering your question as I cannot see or find your post and how you stated it. Too many threads to remember I guess.

[bonnie]

I can't find where you were and left out at but I do remember what you said and would like to answer your question of using the funds of "little abused people".
 Here is the deal as I see it. Not that it matters except if it is right in the sight of God.

If it is right in the sight of God is the key isn't it
. 

I see it is of no concern the personal lives of Bob, Galion, or even DS. As no one has complete control what happens in their persoal lives.

Many things we can't control, our personal behaviour is something we can. Our motivation for acting in a certain way.
The personal life of each, that has contributed to the current problem is of concern.
If less than ethical people are attacked, called to account my less than ethical people it is a problem. It never works well for instance to rail against a drunk, if you(general) are a drunk. If you are a tax cheat turning someone in that cheats on his taxes.

What really is of concern in the 3abn saga is the "misuse and abuse" of the decieved givers of funds to DS and then let his personal life come in play to gain the assests to himself and therefore away from Linda and known victims

That is a concern and important but does not excuse what Bob has suggested.

Bob and Gallon's personal life had nothing to do with 3abn's misuse of funds.  I really do not care how it is stopped whether it be by News media, Bob, Gallon, or some powerful person.

Then let Bob and Gailon do as they choose without involving others. More often than not in scandals the media is quite good in investigating the accuser to see how they stack up.
Perhaps Bob is ready to place his family in that position.

I would not have cared how or who if someone would have stood up for us They took our money, land and business all to the tune of greed and political use. Right is right and truth is truth. I want you to remember one thing. No one stood up for Jesus at the trial! But he was right.
Now, this is how I feel about the matter

I am well aware of the circumstances surrounding Jesus and no one standing up for him. I also remember there was someone called Judas pretending to be a disciple and friend. Keep that one in mind

As far as letting those "little abused people" to put up the funds. I guess I would rather see the funds used to clean up the mess instead of DS using it for extravaganza and personal ego and entertainment. I am not sure about answering your question as I cannot see or find your post and how you stated it. Too many threads to remember I guess.

What do you think would be cleaned up. If and I don't know that they have,the IRS has completed it's investigation,if those that claim they were fired as whistleblowers,if TS never charged or convicted was given a tribute,what is it you expect to happen.

Some nasty publicity that actually fades rather quickly from the mind of the public.
What doesn't from friends,family,church is what can easily prove the accuser and his life to be as distasteful as what they claim to want to clean up

[bonnie]

tinka,
I don't know what took place in your life,it does not sound pleasent.
Our family had it's own ordeal. Not going into it in detail but how would you think my son's personal life would have been no one's business if he accused the pastor of having an "affair" with my DIL, at the same time my son's behavior was same.

If my son had been an abusive husband how would it have worked to accuse someone else as being an abusive husband


Just to add, If someone is discovered to have a certain behaviour as a pattern of his/her life?
You can bet if the media was even interested they would be taking a close look at the accuser.

edited to add last paragraph

[tinka]

I can't find where you were and left out at but I do remember what you said and would like to answer your question of using the funds of "little abused people".
 Here is the deal as I see it. Not that it matters except if it is right in the sight of God.

If it is right in the sight of God is the key isn't it


Bonnie

Hmm, I think I'm starting to get the hang of posting now.
What do I think should be cleared up at 3abn!! I would like to see new faces in charge or control, that you know you can trust, believe, justice served, better managment, accountability of pew funds, more outside music, feature more local churches in different areas, at least someone that does not pull their own chain, but what can I say. I have not watched it since this started and that has been some time ago. My most favorite part was when Linda sat on the porch and did her short stories. There was just one thing though that did get my attention a little as I have never been in any other religion and I did not understand the strangness of her raising her hand when praying. I am not sure my hands are so clean to hold up to the Lord. I feel like crawing in a hole when I come to him. I want to be so clean in his sight. I was never used to that and still not but she had an honest beautiful talented humble face. But other then all the documents that I have read. I still feel that she was duped. To tell you the truth when I read about the little test she did on DS. I just laughted because if my husband ever accused me of something like that, that very well could have been something I would have done too. Really I related to that. IF he constantly accused me of an affair. I am very afraid I could have done something like that too. But who knows for sure again their personal life. That is what I am saying. IF there is no way to prove anything ONLY GO BY WHAT YOU CAN SEE. DS and LS have personal lives that only God know the truth. But the truth we can see without doubt is great extravaganza, intertainment, (horses, sport cars, planes, rolex, hair, and what makes it tick) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.
Bonnie, I do not know anyone at all on here. Actually I am reading because I watch what happens to the church and its people, and I do this and the patterns of peoples post on which side they are on I relate well into all the books that EGW wrote. I found they are the best phycology books that one could ever read. I think this helps keep my sanity of what has happened in our lives.

Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant. Really I am on here as green as you can get but very very familar with every article that has been presented in documents. Any jury that took the time to read all would as I see it would put DS in the hot seat. And believe me I am a person that has to have no doubt. For anything any different I need to see the proof.  I do know some people that worked at 3abn and that used to be pretty close but at this time I would not want to expand on who they are but sure wished I knew if they were still there. Oh well. You know Bonnie, somethime it takes some one special, rough, tough, educated, ruthless, talent to put together unseen hidden, evil deeds out in the open. I consider that smart as a serpent. If only my husband I and would have had those traits maybe we could have seen the evil coming our way. It was so unexpected. unexplainable and felt at the time the Lord entirely disowned us and in our hearts were faithful all the years. Now our children, I just can't go on...... I sort of take personal what happens to God's church that It took me seven years to read about. I believe it. I see it.

. 

I see it is of no concern the personal lives of Bob, Galion, or even DS. As no one has complete control what happens in their persoal lives.

Many things we can't control, our personal behaviour is something we can. Our motivation for acting in a certain way.
The personal life of each, that has contributed to the current problem is of concern.
If less than ethical people are attacked, called to account my less than ethical people it is a problem. It never works well for instance to rail against a drunk, if you(general) are a drunk. If you are a tax cheat turning someone in that cheats on his taxes.

What really is of concern in the 3abn saga is the "misuse and abuse" of the decieved givers of funds to DS and then let his personal life come in play to gain the assests to himself and therefore away from Linda and known victims

That is a concern and important but does not excuse what Bob has suggested.

Bob and Gallon's personal life had nothing to do with 3abn's misuse of funds.  I really do not care how it is stopped whether it be by News media, Bob, Gallon, or some powerful person.

Then let Bob and Gailon do as they choose without involving others. More often than not in scandals the media is quite good in investigating the accuser to see how they stack up.
Perhaps Bob is ready to place his family in that position.

I would not have cared how or who if someone would have stood up for us They took our money, land and business all to the tune of greed and political use. Right is right and truth is truth. I want you to remember one thing. No one stood up for Jesus at the trial! But he was right.
Now, this is how I feel about the matter

I am well aware of the circumstances surrounding Jesus and no one standing up for him. I also remember there was someone called Judas pretending to be a disciple and friend. Keep that one in mind

As far as letting those "little abused people" to put up the funds. I guess I would rather see the funds used to clean up the mess instead of DS using it for extravaganza and personal ego and entertainment. I am not sure about answering your question as I cannot see or find your post and how you stated it. Too many threads to remember I guess.

What do you think would be cleaned up. If and I don't know that they have,the IRS has completed it's investigation,if those that claim they were fired as whistleblowers,if TS never charged or convicted was given a tribute,what is it you expect to happen.

Some nasty publicity that actually fades rather quickly from the mind of the public.
What doesn't from friends,family,church is what can easily prove the accuser and his life to be as distasteful as what they claim to want to clean up

[bonnie]

Hmm, I think I'm starting to get the hang of posting now.
What do I think should be cleared up at 3abn!! I would like to see new faces in charge or control, that you know you can trust, believe, justice served, better managment, accountability of pew funds, more outside music, feature more local churches in different areas, at least someone that does not pull their own chain, but what can I say. I have not watched it since this started and that has been some time ago. My most favorite part was when Linda sat on the porch and did her short stories

3ABN is not the church. It is an independent ministry. We cannot demand new faces in charge,we cannot force better management. Accusing someone that is guilty may force  a change for a time,but unless they change it isn't going to happen. Accountibility of funds should be a given but usually is not.  We don't have full accountibility from the SDA official org.

 

I still feel that she was duped. To tell you the truth when I read about the little test she did on DS. I just laughted because if my husband ever accused me of something like that, that very well could have been something I would have done too. Really I related to that. IF he constantly accused me of an affair. I am very afraid I could have done something like that too.

Maybe she was. So how does that become the business at this time of the internet world. If there is a legal recourse she is the one that has to take it. If she does not it is a dead issue.

To plant a pregnancy test for an already accusing husband is the height of foolishness.


 

IF there is no way to prove anything ONLY GO BY WHAT YOU CAN SEE. DS and LS have personal lives that only God know the truth. But the truth we can see without doubt is great extravaganza, intertainment, (horses, sport cars, planes, rolex, hair, and what makes it tick) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.

No one can undo what has been done. If Bob and Gailon wish to [pursue if they can go for it,but do it upfront and honestly. Stop with the innuendos and implications. If you know something to have actually happened that is important, quit playing with it and say so



 

Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant.

It was clergy sexual abuse of my DIL and lead to the breakup of their marriage. His behaviour was known to many for 30 years. No I did not say my son was doing same. I did say if he was guilty of same he would have looked pretty silly accusing and condemning the pastor

Really I am on here as green as you can get but very very familar with every article that has been presented in documents. Any jury that took the time to read all would as I see it would put DS in the hot seat. And believe me I am a person that has to have no doubt. For anything any different I need to see the proof.  I do know some people that worked at 3abn and that used to be pretty close but at this time I would not want to expand on who they are but sure wished I knew if they were still there. Oh well

Then the answer is quite simple for Bob and Gailon,get it in front of a jury. Stop the implications. The pretense ,the asking others to do the dirty work of going to the sleezy media such as National Enquirer



.

You know Bonnie, somethime it takes some one special, rough, tough, educated, ruthless, talent to put together unseen hidden, evil deeds out in the open. I consider that smart as a serpent. If only my husband I and would have had those traits maybe we could have seen the evil coming our way. It was so unexpected. unexplainable and felt at the time the Lord entirely disowned us and in our hearts were faithful all the years. Now our children, I just can't go on...... I sort of take personal what happens to God's church that It took me seven years to read about. I believe it. I see it.

This is not God's church. It is an independent ministry,not under the control of the SDA. Usually you do have to be tough enough,but ruthless is not a word I would use. The end does not justify the means. Fight it without childish pretense as in the "Explosive New Charges" silliness. Stop playing gotcha with any that can be found connected to 3ABN,not following the sabbath according to Bob's dictates.

If your (general) own reputation cannot withstand medis scrutiny,don't ask anyone else to do it for you..
You seem to have Bob's litany of complaints down remarkably well



edited to correct formatting. 

 

[tinka]

Hmm, I think I'm starting to get the hang of posting now.
What do I think should be cleared up at 3abn!! I would like to see new faces in charge or control, that you know you can trust, believe, justice served, better managment, accountability of pew funds, more outside music, feature more local churches in different areas, at least someone that does not pull their own chain, but what can I say. I have not watched it since this started and that has been some time ago. My most favorite part was when Linda sat on the porch and did her short stories

3ABN is not the church. It is an independent ministry. We cannot demand new faces in charge,we cannot force better management. Accusing someone that is guilty may force  a change for a time,but unless they change it isn't going to happen. Accountibility of funds should be a given but usually is not.  We don't have full accountibility from the SDA official org.
Bonnie, I agree for sure, no doubt about it. It's the church they sucked in....

 

I still feel that she was duped. To tell you the truth when I read about the little test she did on DS. I just laughted because if my husband ever accused me of something like that, that very well could have been something I would have done too. Really I related to that. IF he constantly accused me of an affair. I am very afraid I could have done something like that too.

Maybe she was. So how does that become the business at this time of the internet world. If there is a legal recourse she is the one that has to take it. If she does not it is a dead issue.

To plant a pregnancy test for an already accusing husband is the height of foolishness.
Sometimes husbands have to be taught a foolish lesson. That is of course if you know they really love you. My husband and I have a great understanding of things. (smile)


 

IF there is no way to prove anything ONLY GO BY WHAT YOU CAN SEE. DS and LS have personal lives that only God know the truth. But the truth we can see without doubt is great extravaganza, intertainment, (horses, sport cars, planes, rolex, hair, and what makes it tick) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.

No one can undo what has been done. If Bob and Gailon wish to [pursue if they can go for it,but do it upfront and honestly. Stop with the innuendos and implications. If you know something to have actually happened that is important, quit playing with it and say so



 

Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant.

It was clergy sexual abuse of my DIL and lead to the breakup of their marriage. His behaviour was known to many for 30 years. No I did not say my son was doing same. I did say if he was guilty of same he would have looked pretty silly accusing and condemning the pastor
Believe me I know this can happen with an SDA pastor as well as any. I had one come on to me in early years and was so nieve that I hardly knew where he was coming from until his arm slid around me and started pulling me to sit on his lap. I was shocked and horrified. I could not believe it. Yes I was sad at the time (18 yrs ol) It was embarassing to get rid of him. I was so horrified that I kept it to myself and suffered that a married man tried to touch me. It kept me from church for a while as this one came in as an evangeligist. I often wondered what happened and what he did next. I only finally spoke of it to my husband just a couple of years ago. Wouldn't that be terrible if this was the same clergy!

Really I am on here as green as you can get but very very familar with every article that has been presented in documents. Any jury that took the time to read all would as I see it would put DS in the hot seat. And believe me I am a person that has to have no doubt. For anything any different I need to see the proof.  I do know some people that worked at 3abn and that used to be pretty close but at this time I would not want to expand on who they are but sure wished I knew if they were still there. Oh well

Then the answer is quite simple for Bob and Gailon,get it in front of a jury. Stop the implications. The pretense ,the asking others to do the dirty work of going to the sleezy media such as National Enquirer



.

You know Bonnie, somethime it takes some one special, rough, tough, educated, ruthless, talent to put together unseen hidden, evil deeds out in the open. I consider that smart as a serpent. If only my husband I and would have had those traits maybe we could have seen the evil coming our way. It was so unexpected. unexplainable and felt at the time the Lord entirely disowned us and in our hearts were faithful all the years. Now our children, I just can't go on...... I sort of take personal what happens to God's church that It took me seven years to read about. I believe it. I see it.

This is not God's church. It is an independent ministry,not under the control of the SDA. Usually you do have to be tough enough,but ruthless is not a word I would use. The end does not justify the means. Fight it without childish pretense as in the "Explosive New Charges" silliness. Stop playing gotcha with any that can be found connected to 3ABN,not following the sabbath according to Bob's dictates.

  Again Bonnie, That is what makes DS the Pied piper to misuse, abuse, and use the Adventists to benefit his desires and they all followed like the pigs over the cliff while he is yelling INdependent, Independent. He used The Advent message, There 3 Angels symbols. That makes him so much worse. That is a big deciever, and a thief in my book.

If your (general) own reputation cannot withstand medis scrutiny,don't ask anyone else to do it for you..
You seem to have Bob's litany of complaints down remarkably well,

I came to my own conclusion by the visual facts as I was a great believer in the cause of 3abn. I do not know anyone one here or their background. I am sorry though about DIL and your son. My shock of this sort of thing was just getting away quick. But again look at the worse secenaro of the victims of TS.


edited to correct formatting. 

 

[bonnie]

 

Bonnie, I agree for sure, no doubt about it. It's the church they sucked in....

But tell me what you are going to do about it? Report them to the GC. Frankly I would suspect we have them here reading as it goes.
The IRS,if that has been concluded not a thing anyone can do. If not and the IRS is still investigating something may come of it. But that is out of the hands of most one here.
You need a concrete complaint before the IRS gets into a lentghy and expensive investigation

Sometimes husbands have to be taught a foolish lesson. That is of course if you know they really love you. My husband and I have a great understanding of things. (smile)

If this woman needed to teach a already accusing husband her husband and her did not have a great understanding of things.


 [quote) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.[/quote]

"The whatever it takes" is the problem. The accuser becomes as bad as the accused

No one can undo what has been done. If Bob and Gailon wish to [pursue if they can go for it,but do it upfront and honestly. Stop with the innuendos and implications. If you know something to have actually happened that is important, quit playing with it and say so



 

Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant.

Believe me I know this can happen with an SDA pastor as well as any. I had one come on to me in early years and was so naive that I hardly knew where he was coming from until his arm slid around me and started pulling me to sit on his lap. I was shocked and horrified. I could not believe it. Yes I was sad at the time (18 yrs ol) It was embarrassing to get rid of him. I was so horrified that I kept it to myself and suffered that a married man tried to touch me. It kept me from church for a while as this one came in as an Evangelist. I often wondered what happened and what he did next. I only finally spoke of it to my husband just a couple of years ago. Wouldn't that be terrible if this was the same clergy!

Be careful of that,Bob will want to know the exact day you do and the exact day leadership knew. Or  a statement made that we have had this going on in the denomination since EW can have Bob wanting to know the dates she knew




Then the answer is quite simple for Bob and Gailon,get it in front of a jury. Stop the implications. The pretense ,the asking others to do the dirty work of going to the sleazy media such as National Enquirer

  Again Bonnie, That is what makes DS the Pied piper to misuse, abuse, and use the Adventists to benefit his desires and they all followed like the pigs over the cliff while he is yelling INdependent, Independent. He used The Advent message, There 3 Angels symbols. That makes him so much worse. That is a big deceiver, and a thief in my book.

Two sides follow like pigs,just a toss up to who hits bottom first.
The advent message in the wrong hands does a great deal of damage.

I came to my own conclusion by the visual facts as I was a great believer in the cause of 3abn. I do not know anyone one here or their background. I am sorry though about DIL and your son. My shock of this sort of thing was just getting away quick. But again look at the worse scenario of the victims of TS.

I don't have to look now,I know what happens to many victims. The fact of the matter is no one can do anything to TS. He is not a criminal on the loose,he has not been charged and convicted and DS did nothing illegal about hiring him. I believe people like that belong in prison for a very long time,but ain't going to happen in this. Bob and Gailon cannot fight as a stand in for the alleged victims.


Using sneaky,silly underhanded tactics of Bob and Gailon is not going to make it all right and go away

[Bob Pickle]

3ABN issued a press release. Thus they apparently want it circulated to every media outlet possible.

Anyone sent it on? If so, report back here, if you can, who you sent it to. CNN, ABC, NBC, Fox, Larry King, Rush Limbaugh, National Enquirer, whoever.

And I am available for interviews, since responsible media wouldn't want to simply take 3ABN's word for it that the information in 3ABN's press release is true.

[calvin]

The going ons at 3ABN is hardly newsworthy in Adventism or the Adventist press....0 newsworthy to the religious press and mainstream media.

[tinka]

Calvin,
Signs of the Times--Who does care about theft on a Corporate basis. Surley not you.

[Snoopy]

I disagree.

The going ons at 3ABN is hardly newsworthy in Adventism or the Adventist press....0 newsworthy to the religious press and mainstream media.

[skiguy]

Daryl Fawcett, Daryl, could you contact me at my email, skiguyfun@aol.com, thanks.  Something want to share with you

[Daryl Fawcett]

Just sent you an email, as I am unable to receive PMs here since leaving admin.

[Snoopy]

Daryl, is there any chance your mailbox might be full?

Just sent you an email, as I am unable to receive PMs here since leaving admin.

[Daryl Fawcett]

It's only full on account of the fact I am no longer on staff, as being on staff didn't have any limitations, which I already knew by the way.