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[Snoopy]

I'll bet Linda wouldn't offer to answer any questions you might have now, Jeanette!!  I am quite certain Linda is among the group of folks who have learned not to trust you with information they want to keep private!!

Back on July 5, 2007, as I drove her around sight seeing, Linda Shelton offered to answer any questions I might have.  We discussed many things over those hours, including the posting of her daughter's letter.  She confirmed that her daughter was furious that it had been made public and also that her daughter has no plans to pursue charges against Danny or use her experience in any way.  This part of the discussion was not among the things that she stated were confidential.  Her feelings about who posted the letter and why it was posted, as well as just how she felt about the person who posted it, were among the things that she asked me not to share with others.

With Linda's daughter's letter being exploited, yet again, I shared with Ian what Linda had openly shared with me.  She did not get this particular information from "Someone who doesn't mind some false statements made to cover up his evil actions?".  I provided it during an off-forum discussion about how this type of exploitation re-abuses alleged victims.

Those who continue to bring up Linda's daughter's letter to support their case against Danny Shelton are not respecting the wishes of this young woman.  They are potetially causing her further stress and pain for their own purposes and should be ashamed of using such tactics.  If they are truly concerned for her welfare, they will take their concerns to her privately.

[GrandmaNettie]

Just so it is abundantly clear to all, the information I shared from Linda Shelton was NOT specified as private or confidential.  There were things discussed in both our face-to-face conversation and the email that WERE specified as private and/or confidential, which I why I didn't post them here.

It is up to each individual to determine who to believe about anything.  Some choose to believe facts/truth, others choose to believe lies for whatever reason.  Some even attempt to shift the focus from facts to an attack on the messenger.   

While I don't enjoy having my character impuned or being charged with things I am not guilty of, it is more important for me to follow principle and defend the facts as I know them.  That is the only reason I even posted here today... to attempt to defend Alyssa against further exploitation, according to her wishes, and to stand up for Duane.

   

It is my understanding that after it was mailed out to a bunch of unrelated and uninvolved individuals, Linda Shelton said that she didn't want to pursue anything and did not want anything made public.

It would be interesting to find out how you have spun your way to those understandings. Or is it someone else who is doing the spinning for you? Someone who doesn't mind some false statements made to cover up his evil actions? Do you think Linda would agree to what you are saying about her? Unless you can document what you have said your words are a blatant spin to give a false impression.

Just so the facts are clear, this is an answer from Linda Shelton to an email I sent to her to advise her that her daughter's letter had been posted again.  It is only the beginning of  her email to me because she specified that that balance was private to me:

----- Original Message -----
From: linda@lindashelton.org
To: ***Me***
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 10:08 AM
Subject: RE: AM's Letter


Hi *******,

Thanks for writing.  Johann called me earlier and told me Alyssa's letter has been revived.  Her letter was NEVER intended for public viewing.  She wrote it for the purpose of church authorities getting this message only.

Back on July 5, 2007, as I drove her around sight seeing, Linda Shelton offered to answer any questions I might have.  We discussed many things over those hours, including the posting of her daughter's letter.  She confirmed that her daughter was furious that it had been made public and also that her daughter has no plans to pursue charges against Danny or use her experience in any way.  This part of the discussion was not among the things that she stated were confidential.  Her feelings about who posted the letter and why it was posted, as well as just how she felt about the person who posted it, were among the things that she asked me not to share with others.

With Linda's daughter's letter being exploited, yet again, I shared with Ian what Linda had openly shared with me.  She did not get this particular information from "Someone who doesn't mind some false statements made to cover up his evil actions?".  I provided it during an off-forum discussion about how this type of exploitation re-abuses alleged victims.

Those who continue to bring up Linda's daughter's letter to support their case against Danny Shelton are not respecting the wishes of this young woman.  They are potetially causing her further stress and pain for their own purposes and should be ashamed of using such tactics.  If they are truly concerned for her welfare, they will take their concerns to her privately.

[Snoopy]

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

[ex3abnemployee]

GrandmaNettie,

I appreciate your kind words of support. I mean that sincerely. Thank you.

[GrandmaNettie]

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

I have no clue what BSDA chats Ian was referring to.  I only know that she was telling the truth that I didn't provide her with any.  It may even be a question of semantics, for that matter.  I can only speak for myself regarding the subject.  I will state once more for the record that I have not betrayed your confidences.

Whle I don't know what untruths you are referring to on 3abntalk.  I do know that at least one member there has come to erroneous conclusions when reading your court record they posted there.  I think letting the court record speak for itself is the best defense. When I read that particular member's conlusions I was rather embarassed for the member.  I doubt that many who use common sense can reach the same conclusions that the one member reached by reading the two pages of your court record as posted.

There are many untruths being posted on this site that I have not spoken up against.  People will believe what they choose to believe. There is little I can do to alter that.

You are correct.  I am a bit selective about who I choose to defend.  I defended Alyssa because she does not have a voice here and I happen to know her wishes.  I defended Duane because I understand the system he is emerging from and want to encourage  him in his resolve.  I don't speak out much any more because my perspective is an irritation here, so I prefer to stay mostly mute.  There is no fence under my bum.  I have always been open about having friends on both sides of the controversy.  There are very few people involved in this that I don't value, respect and consider friends.

[Snoopy]

Hhmm.  And I believe there is recent, documented proof otherwise.  Sorry Jeanette - I don't believe you.  Have you jumped on your good friend Ian to set the record straight?  You and Cindi are simply behind-the-scenes manipulators.  I pity you.

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

I have no clue what BSDA chats Ian was referring to.  I only know that she was telling the truth that I didn't provide her with any.  It may even be a question of semantics, for that matter.  I can only speak for myself regarding the subject.  I will state once more for the record that I have not betrayed your confidences.

Whle I don't know what untruths you are referring to on 3abntalk.  I do know that at least one member there has come to erroneous conclusions when reading your court record they posted there.  I think letting the court record speak for itself is the best defense. When I read that particular member's conlusions I was rather embarassed for the member.  I doubt that many who use common sense can reach the same conclusions that the one member reached by reading the two pages of your court record as posted.

There are many untruths being posted on this site that I have not spoken up against.  People will believe what they choose to believe. There is little I can do to alter that.

You are correct.  I am a bit selective about who I choose to defend.  I defended Alyssa because she does not have a voice here and I happen to know her wishes.  I defended Duane because I understand the system he is emerging from and want to encourage  him in his resolve.  I don't speak out much any more because my perspective is an irritation here, so I prefer to stay mostly mute.  There is no fence under my bum.  I have always been open about having friends on both sides of the controversy.  There are very few people involved in this that I don't value, respect and consider friends.

[Bob Pickle]

I'm not the one who created this mess in the first place. It's not my place to initiate contact.

Exactly. Your having to contact them would kind of be like Simpson asking us to write up a settlement proposal. They started it, so they should do that first.

[GrandmaNettie]

GrandmaNettie,

I appreciate your kind words of support. I mean that sincerely. Thank you.

You're sincerely welcome, Duane.  

[Bob Pickle]

It is my understanding that after it was mailed out to a bunch of unrelated and uninvolved individuals, Linda Shelton said that she didn't want to pursue anything and did not want anything made public.

It would be interesting to find out how you have spun your way to those understandings. Or is it someone else who is doing the spinning for you? Someone who doesn't mind some false statements made to cover up his evil actions? Do you think Linda would agree to what you are saying about her? Unless you can document what you have said your words are a blatant spin to give a false impression.

Just so the facts are clear, this is an answer from Linda Shelton to an email I sent to her to advise her that her daughter's letter had been posted again.  It is only the beginning of  her email to me because she specified that that balance was private to me:

I'm not sure that what you posted makes what Ian posted accurate.

It was mailed out to unrelated and uninvolved individuals with Alyssa's permission in the summer of 2006. I do not recall any statement by Linda after and because of that that would matcvh what Ian said.

Those who continue to bring up Linda's daughter's letter to support their case against Danny Shelton are not respecting the wishes of this young woman.  They are potetially causing her further stress and pain for their own purposes and should be ashamed of using such tactics.  If they are truly concerned for her welfare, they will take their concerns to her privately.

The situation is a bit different now, since the whole thing is a matter of court record.

[GrandmaNettie]

Please post what you consider "recent documented proof" and allow the readers to determine if it is valid and if it applies rather than simply alleging it exists.

Hhmm.  And I believe there is recent, documented proof otherwise.  Sorry Jeanette - I don't believe you.  Have you jumped on your good friend Ian to set the record straight?  You and Cindi are simply behind-the-scenes manipulators.  I pity you.

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

I have no clue what BSDA chats Ian was referring to.  I only know that she was telling the truth that I didn't provide her with any.  It may even be a question of semantics, for that matter.  I can only speak for myself regarding the subject.  I will state once more for the record that I have not betrayed your confidences.

Whle I don't know what untruths you are referring to on 3abntalk.  I do know that at least one member there has come to erroneous conclusions when reading your court record they posted there.  I think letting the court record speak for itself is the best defense. When I read that particular member's conlusions I was rather embarassed for the member.  I doubt that many who use common sense can reach the same conclusions that the one member reached by reading the two pages of your court record as posted.

There are many untruths being posted on this site that I have not spoken up against.  People will believe what they choose to believe. There is little I can do to alter that.

You are correct.  I am a bit selective about who I choose to defend.  I defended Alyssa because she does not have a voice here and I happen to know her wishes.  I defended Duane because I understand the system he is emerging from and want to encourage  him in his resolve.  I don't speak out much any more because my perspective is an irritation here, so I prefer to stay mostly mute.  There is no fence under my bum.  I have always been open about having friends on both sides of the controversy.  There are very few people involved in this that I don't value, respect and consider friends.

[GrandmaNettie]

It is my understanding that after it was mailed out to a bunch of unrelated and uninvolved individuals, Linda Shelton said that she didn't want to pursue anything and did not want anything made public.

It would be interesting to find out how you have spun your way to those understandings. Or is it someone else who is doing the spinning for you? Someone who doesn't mind some false statements made to cover up his evil actions? Do you think Linda would agree to what you are saying about her? Unless you can document what you have said your words are a blatant spin to give a false impression.

Just so the facts are clear, this is an answer from Linda Shelton to an email I sent to her to advise her that her daughter's letter had been posted again.  It is only the beginning of  her email to me because she specified that that balance was private to me:

I'm not sure that what you posted makes what Ian posted accurate.

It was mailed out to unrelated and uninvolved individuals with Alyssa's permission in the summer of 2006. I do not recall any statement by Linda after and because of that that would matcvh what Ian said.

Those who continue to bring up Linda's daughter's letter to support their case against Danny Shelton are not respecting the wishes of this young woman.  They are potetially causing her further stress and pain for their own purposes and should be ashamed of using such tactics.  If they are truly concerned for her welfare, they will take their concerns to her privately.

The situation is a bit different now, since the whole thing is a matter of court record.

I highlighted the words in Ian's post that I was comparing to Linda Shelton's email to me but forgot to mention that I was bolding them for that purpose.  I didn't bold the first part because that is not what Linda Shelton said.  It was, instead, Ian's interpretation or opinion of who the letter was mailed out to.


Unless Alyssa has given her approval for her letter and her allegations to be discussed publically, the situation is NOT any different now simply because you have chosen to make the  whole thing a matter of court record.  That doesn't change how the discussion affects Alyssa.  If she has not changed her mind about having her letter and her allegations publically discussed, she is being exploited and re-abused so that you can further your own case against 3abn and Danny Shelton.

Has she specifically given her approval or are you proceeding with this against her specific wishes?  Those who feel they have been victimized should have the right to choose whether or not they are cast into the public eye.  Look at the date of the email to me from Linda Shelton.  Less than a year has elapsed since Linda reaffirmed Alyssa's position:

----- Original Message -----
From: linda@lindashelton.org
To: ***Me***
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 10:08 AM
Subject: RE: AM's Letter


Hi *******,

Thanks for writing.  Johann called me earlier and told me Alyssa's letter has been revived.  Her letter was NEVER intended for public viewing.  She wrote it for the purpose of church authorities getting this message only.

[Snoopy]

Naw - thanks anyway.  It is a private communication.  But you didn't answer my question.  If you are as "in search of the truth" as you claim to be, have you confronted your "good friend Ian" about the lies?

Please post what you consider "recent documented proof" and allow the readers to determine if it is valid and if it applies rather than simply alleging it exists.

Hhmm.  And I believe there is recent, documented proof otherwise.  Sorry Jeanette - I don't believe you.  Have you jumped on your good friend Ian to set the record straight?  You and Cindi are simply behind-the-scenes manipulators.  I pity you.

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

I have no clue what BSDA chats Ian was referring to.  I only know that she was telling the truth that I didn't provide her with any.  It may even be a question of semantics, for that matter.  I can only speak for myself regarding the subject.  I will state once more for the record that I have not betrayed your confidences.

Whle I don't know what untruths you are referring to on 3abntalk.  I do know that at least one member there has come to erroneous conclusions when reading your court record they posted there.  I think letting the court record speak for itself is the best defense. When I read that particular member's conlusions I was rather embarassed for the member.  I doubt that many who use common sense can reach the same conclusions that the one member reached by reading the two pages of your court record as posted.

There are many untruths being posted on this site that I have not spoken up against.  People will believe what they choose to believe. There is little I can do to alter that.

You are correct.  I am a bit selective about who I choose to defend.  I defended Alyssa because she does not have a voice here and I happen to know her wishes.  I defended Duane because I understand the system he is emerging from and want to encourage  him in his resolve.  I don't speak out much any more because my perspective is an irritation here, so I prefer to stay mostly mute.  There is no fence under my bum.  I have always been open about having friends on both sides of the controversy.  There are very few people involved in this that I don't value, respect and consider friends.

[Johann]

Because no affidavits have ever been filed against him and there are no complaints which have been made to 3abn, or the police, or his church from any so called victim. If there were, you would all have posted them long since, right?  The truth is so easy to prove with facts and evidence, isn't it? Liars always have a disadvantage in that area.

..and btw one of the 10 commandments says "thou shalt not bear false witness."

..ian

The statement above is the first falsehood we are dealing with here. Ian even quotes from the commandment as if that gives her license to tell a lie, - apparently because she feels the facts are confidential and/or because she with the aid of another "friend" twists how Linda has expressed herself about how she does not want her daughter exploited.

I can state this much that it was a "friend" who broke our confidence and "leaked" Linda's daughter's statement to people who were not supposed to receive it. This leakage caused an open discussion of her statement, which should not have taken place - and this is what Linda has in mind.

Fact is that Alyssa has never withdrawn her statement. She wrote it herself, and the intention was that is should go to leaders in the Seventh-day Adventist Church. She expected those leaders to investigate. . .  and not treat Alyssa as a criminal because she revealed her step-father's abuse.

When I was asked to get Alyssa to submit to the "trial", I was also told that 3ABN had no intention of changing any of the evil things they had done to Linda, even though Church leaders had tried to get them to renew their former "investigations".  My understanding was that they only wanted to get some people who had the skills to brand Alyssa as a liar to clear Danny's name.

Linda's concern was that Alyssa would not be exploited, humiliated, and destroyed any further than all what that cruel experience had done to her. I have told Linda what you have said about her here, and she feels you are twisting her words to mean something she did not intend - and therefore breaking the commandment you quoted.

[GrandmaNettie]

One might wonder about the credibility of your statement when you post publically that there is recent documented proof against me while you knew full well you were not going to share it because it was private.

I don't pull punches with any of my friends.  I confront what I see as lies and expect the same from them.

Naw - thanks anyway.  It is a private communication.  But you didn't answer my question.  If you are as "in search of the truth" as you claim to be, have you confronted your "good friend Ian" about the lies?

Please post what you consider "recent documented proof" and allow the readers to determine if it is valid and if it applies rather than simply alleging it exists.

Hhmm.  And I believe there is recent, documented proof otherwise.  Sorry Jeanette - I don't believe you.  Have you jumped on your good friend Ian to set the record straight?  You and Cindi are simply behind-the-scenes manipulators.  I pity you.

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

I have no clue what BSDA chats Ian was referring to.  I only know that she was telling the truth that I didn't provide her with any.  It may even be a question of semantics, for that matter.  I can only speak for myself regarding the subject.  I will state once more for the record that I have not betrayed your confidences.

Whle I don't know what untruths you are referring to on 3abntalk.  I do know that at least one member there has come to erroneous conclusions when reading your court record they posted there.  I think letting the court record speak for itself is the best defense. When I read that particular member's conlusions I was rather embarassed for the member.  I doubt that many who use common sense can reach the same conclusions that the one member reached by reading the two pages of your court record as posted.

There are many untruths being posted on this site that I have not spoken up against.  People will believe what they choose to believe. There is little I can do to alter that.

You are correct.  I am a bit selective about who I choose to defend.  I defended Alyssa because she does not have a voice here and I happen to know her wishes.  I defended Duane because I understand the system he is emerging from and want to encourage  him in his resolve.  I don't speak out much any more because my perspective is an irritation here, so I prefer to stay mostly mute.  There is no fence under my bum.  I have always been open about having friends on both sides of the controversy.  There are very few people involved in this that I don't value, respect and consider friends.

[Snoopy]

One might?  I said there was recent, documented proof that something you said was not entirely true.  I never said I was going to share it publically, unlike you and Cindi!!  Maybe I should refresh your memory with a thread you managed to get removed recently.

And you still haven't answered my question.  If you don't "pull punches" and you "confront...lies", have you discussed the untruths posted at Ian's site with her?  What was her response?  Does she care?

One might wonder about the credibility of your statement when you post publically that there is recent documented proof against me while you knew full well you were not going to share it because it was private.

I don't pull punches with any of my friends.  I confront what I see as lies and expect the same from them.

Naw - thanks anyway.  It is a private communication.  But you didn't answer my question.  If you are as "in search of the truth" as you claim to be, have you confronted your "good friend Ian" about the lies?

Please post what you consider "recent documented proof" and allow the readers to determine if it is valid and if it applies rather than simply alleging it exists.

Hhmm.  And I believe there is recent, documented proof otherwise.  Sorry Jeanette - I don't believe you.  Have you jumped on your good friend Ian to set the record straight?  You and Cindi are simply behind-the-scenes manipulators.  I pity you.

Doesn't change my opinion at all.  But since Ian refuses to say what BSDA chats of mine she has seen, maybe you could shed some light on that yet unanswered question, Jeanette...or maybe you could ask Cindi...

And by the way, since you are so busy defending people...  Why haven't you spoken up against the blatant untruths Ian allows to be posted on her site?  Untruths that YOU KNOW are blatant lies, because I CONFIDED IN YOU!!  I think you're a bit selective in who you choose to defend.  But I guess when one is so firmly perched atop a fence trying to play both sides they can't be expected to catch everything...

I have no clue what BSDA chats Ian was referring to.  I only know that she was telling the truth that I didn't provide her with any.  It may even be a question of semantics, for that matter.  I can only speak for myself regarding the subject.  I will state once more for the record that I have not betrayed your confidences.

Whle I don't know what untruths you are referring to on 3abntalk.  I do know that at least one member there has come to erroneous conclusions when reading your court record they posted there.  I think letting the court record speak for itself is the best defense. When I read that particular member's conlusions I was rather embarassed for the member.  I doubt that many who use common sense can reach the same conclusions that the one member reached by reading the two pages of your court record as posted.

There are many untruths being posted on this site that I have not spoken up against.  People will believe what they choose to believe. There is little I can do to alter that.

You are correct.  I am a bit selective about who I choose to defend.  I defended Alyssa because she does not have a voice here and I happen to know her wishes.  I defended Duane because I understand the system he is emerging from and want to encourage  him in his resolve.  I don't speak out much any more because my perspective is an irritation here, so I prefer to stay mostly mute.  There is no fence under my bum.  I have always been open about having friends on both sides of the controversy.  There are very few people involved in this that I don't value, respect and consider friends.