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[Habanero]

I agree with you that straddling fences can be a problem, but I also see lots of fence-building by leaders who need people to create sides, and by people who simply prefer to have fences there for a host of reasons. In either case the fences are largely false and unnecessary and so is the taking of sides. This is especially true where both sides are the same in principle. It is my opinion that this is true in politics and in racial spats. The specifics may vary, but the principles are the same.

[tinka]

False fences forces people that can only follow-- choose.

[princessdi]

Now, I must admit that I was unfamiliar with ACORN, as I was raised pretty much middle class, and went to high school in an upper middle neighborhood of Northern CA.  I had heard the term, but just unfamiliar with what was their purpose.  I am now listening to what this organization stands for, it seems to be helping low an dmiddle income citizens.  What I am listneing to now has some people up there who turned to Acorn for help with their housing issues......working class people. 

So Tinka, what exactly is your issue with this org?  I am moving on from the other, because it is going around in circles. 

Habanero, I am indeed mistaken.  It is true that politicans are politicians. I totally agree with your statement about people being disappointed who have unrealistic expectation of Preisdent Obama.  Personally, I beleive for blacks(and all others), for those who were giving excuses, they are now gone.  We can no longer place blame.  That is not to say that history( both ancient and recent) is not just exactly that, true history, and we should not forget in order not to repeat it.  That doesn't say that racism and racist attitude against blacks do not still exist, they do.  They do within the SDA church...........no, the regional conferences are not cultural diversity.  They stand as reminders of the racism that persists since the beginning when blacks were initially evangleized into the church.  However, God works for all His Chidlren, too.  There is a song that goes "What God has for me, it is for me", we all need to believe that.

I know I am pretty much fighting a losing battle here, because most of you can never know what it is to "live" with racism and discrimination.  Some may have had a incident or two, but you will never know how it can affect your entire life.  Tinka, has all the right answes that puts racism squarely at the feet of those who choose to acknowledge that it exists.  That is not what fuels racism.  If we never mention again, it would still exist. 

As I said, I am now moving on,a nd all i am rellly intersted in or will reply to is the question that I asked Tinka about ACORN.

[tinka]

Princessdi,

Actually I have a broken heart that any human being as ever had to go through what has been in the past because of race. I have a big imagination of how horrible Christian torture explained in books. It is bad enough to know what is in the future to come. I love people, I have horrible visions of people being lost because of this injustice that cannot seemily be overcome. I don't think racism is going to get us to heaven. I love that relationship of a few of my friends that I have (even if not the same faith) as they have overcome their feelings . All we have is human unity and I love their quick wit and the way they put things quicker then I can think as I get to know more and more. Pay closer attention to Mike Steel and others on Fox. His agenda to us is right on and a wonderful man.

As far as Acorn goes they worked under a new management brought on by the far left and funded by the far left to get millions of illigal votes that did not even exist to voter fraud. It was all over the news in almost every state and are now in investagation. Obama few years ago jived up the Acorn in this manner under his management. Ah, I probably am not explaing it just correctly but it is just too much to go into. But watched it intensely months before the election  and they proved who funded it and for what reason. It was premeditated since Obama was in Chicago and that is what his accomplishments were with the far left. If you will watch Fox. you will finally get the details beyond there housing woes of acorn as I don't think it is over. You did not get this story on the liberal stations. It had some also to do with Soros money, Ophrah money and HollyWood. I hated to see Hollywood at the White House for the ball!!!! But it is over and who knows what will happen "After the ball is over"......... I know we might even like each other in real person (smile)

[Fran]

For anyone.

"Uwdedidc M wdfc fexved fcsgmes lvc aqfidcx, M lddq f ajcves mktgqad jv add mj jcmdy ve wmk tdcavefqqx."   

By:  Fncfwfk Qmezvqe

F=A
M=I
X=Y

[christined]

"Uwdedidc M wdfc fexved fcsgmes lvc aqfidcx, M lddq f ajcves mktgqad jv add mj jcmdy ve wmk tdcavefqqx."   

By:  Fncfwfk Qmezvqe

F=A
M=I
X=Y

"Whenever I hear anyone arguing for slavery, I feel a strong impulse to see it tried on him personally."

By: Abraham Lincoln

 

[tinka]

Very GOOD AND FIT saying or argument for Abraham Lincoln back in that day and time when slavery was in!

What would be a good saying for NOW IN THIS DAY AND TIME when it has been over???  and Racism is rampid with hatrid??? It could have been different for unity of people if the word "forgiven was in the heart" that was my point. and I just don't see it on here

[Fran]

That was fast!  Old Abraham was a wise fellow.

[RBF]

Were you there when they crucified my Lord?
Were you there when they nailed Him to the tree?
Were you there when they pierced Him in the side?
Were you there when the sun refused to shine?
Were you there when they laid Him in the tomb?
(Excerpted from the Seventh-day Adventist Hymnal #158)

The obvious answer is yes I was there.  I hope you believe this.  If not, please don’t sing this song next time it is sung.  Second Corinthians 5:14 says, “For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead.”

“This was the position of the human race after man divorced himself from God by transgression.  Then he was no longer entitled to a breath of air, a ray of sunshine, or a particle of food.  And the reason why man was not annihilated was because God so loved him that He made the gift of His dear Son that He should suffer the penalty of his transgression.  Christ proposed to become man’s surety and substitute, that man, through matchless grace, should have another trial—a second probation—having the experience of Adam and Eve as a warning not to transgress God’s law as they did.”  FW 21

When we acknowledge that we were there, we can confess much and therefore be forgiven much.  Praise God for this probationary life.  It means that “we might be made the righteousness of God in Him!” 

With this knowledge comes the realization that I was there bartering and beating slaves, killing Jews and murdering the Tutsis. You say, “How?”  Jesus says, “ye build the tombs of the prophets....and say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.  Wherefore ye be witnesses against yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.”  (Matthew 23:29-31)  Please read the remaining part of the chapter.  Unless we learn to repent for the sins of our forefathers (that are ours in heart) we shall have plenty of opportunity as did the Jews to repeat them. 

We were there.  We crucified the Lord.  If we would like to be included in His prayer “Father forgive them,” then we must acknowledge our participation in the murder at Calvary.  “Sometimes it causes me to tremble, tremble, tremble.”  Only when God has a people who can acknowledge the true extent of the sin that is in their hearts, can they find healing and wholeness.  It is time for God’s people to experience the spirit of grace and of supplications that will lead them to see Christ as the One whom “they have pierced” and to bitterly mourn for Him. Zech. 12:10.   God can give us a deep repentance, not simply for sins that we have outwardly committed in our short and sheltered lives, but for the sins that we see in others and which the Scriptures teach are as fully present in our own self-righteous hearts as in theirs.   Those who are seeking and approaching the state of being “perfect in Christ” will never dare to say with Peter, “Though all shall be offended because of thee, yet will I never be offended.” Matt. 26:33.   “Most men will proclaim every one his own goodness:  but a faithful man who can find?”  Prov. 20:6.   PrincessDi, my sincere apologies for what we did to you.

RBF

[Johann]

  PrincessDi, my sincere apologies for what we did to you.

RBF

AMEN!