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[bonnie]

This was posted by Ginge on C/A. Just exactly when is the membership going to treat this as little more than a hang nail.
Several posts in response are very negative.



Fellow readers,

The following was posted on another website:

A General Conference official reports a growing problem of spouse abuse in the church. GC women’s ministries director Heather-Dawn Small says there’s an urgent need for abuse prevention. Read an interview with Small in this week’s Adentist Review. http://www.adventistreview.org/article.php?id=2077

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The follow up to the above article took up 4 pages of discussion by reader's on that site, feeling that the denomination is not doing much to help the abuse in our church. We have posted on this website (and others) about how helpful our book can be for those that are being abused, to very little avail. Are we apathetic, or is it just easy to see the problem but not want to be part of fixing the problem. So here are our frustrations about all this discussion.


"Everyone has something to say about the "church, or denomination" not doing anything about abuse. I started a discussion, on 4 different websites, on abuse in the Adventist church in May, before our book came out, which was in July, in order to wake people up to the abuse issue. There have been long and sometimes emotional discussions. Who of you out there have been willing to go the next step, after posting, and actually buy the book and give it to your pastor or church library? Who has been willing to help us out by asking your ABC to order the books? Who has contacted their church'es Women's Ministry and ask them to promote the book at the next women's session? Who?

There is a lot of talk going on but I know of only 4 books that have been bought by anyone on these websites. There is a big pink banner advertising Polly's Place on one website and Stan has outdone himself to help advertise the book on this site, but Dr. Mable Dunbar is floundering for donations and even for emotional support.

Yes, the book is succeeding with a lot of hours on our part to contact the heads of Women's Org. everywhere. Mable and I are spending our own money to bring help and healing to the abused women in our church'es and there are many wome. We have orders for cases of books from So. Africa and So. Korea. They are suffering there also. I sent a case to a radio station in Tenn. that is using them for promotion to all-denominational pastor's in their area. I have an order for a case to go to the Adventist Women's Convention in Florida in Oct. "We Suffered In Silence" presents a source of help and hopefully healing to our hurting Adventist women.

You're right, part of the denomination may overlook the needs of our people (note again that the Womsn't Ministries, worldwide is open for information). People post that nobody is doing anything. Well, those of you reading this are NOT no-bodies you are all some-bodies. We have the opportunity to place a very good resource in leaderships hands. The more that all of you are willing to come forward and put your heart and money into presenting a frontal attack on Adventist abuse the bigger chance we have of actually showing the denomination that the people have something to say (and not just on a website).

Am I frustrated? Yes, I am looking for people that are more than talkers but are willing to be pro-active in this war on abuse. We writer of this book are only three, you are hundreds. If everyone of you that reads this post would go to our books website and order a book and then give it to your church leaders, pastor's, conference presidents, Women's ministry leaders and especially ask the ABC to order the book we will make a BIG impression. So are you with me? Mable and I are not personally making any money. Royalties will go to Polly's Place. But we DO want to make an impact on the denomination.

This article that started this whole discussion in the Sept. Review is the second on Adventist abuse in one year. Are you ready for a frontal attack?

Then go to http://www.preyerplanning.com/book/velva-holt.htm

If you can't buy the book then print off the book information and give it to all these people above.

We really need your help.

Virginia and Bob Coombs

[bonnie]

Some responses without names. It is the typical response to this problem and very easy to see why Ginge is so frustrated.

Anytime you attempt to manipulate people (one example being spamming websites about an issue you just wrote a book about and are trying to sell), and deceive them (one example might be stirring up the pot to get people excited about a book you just wrote and are trying to sell), you are gaining not from wholesome methods, but by deceit. And when has deceit been a positive attribute?

Unless I am misreading Ginge is almost accused of deceit because the book is important to her and should be to all of us

Does it seem odd to you that the author of a book, is pushing for the book to be bought? The cry is that it is an urgent need. And while I agree that there may be pandemic problems, it seems a bit odd and a bit wrong for an author to go to specific religious circles, and convey in the most panick-stricken and urgent sense that we need to do something like buy this book for our churches and possibly another for our pastor...


There are alot of minstrys for battered wives and spousal abuse....and amazingly some are focused on christian women . And there are books....for example, "Violence Among Us" has a book called. "Ministry to Families in Crisis "
By Brenda Branson and Paula J. Silva

[bonnie]

I'm kinda glad you said that, cause I didn't want to. I can't say I wasn't thinking something similar.

This is getting me thinking. What if my wife is abusing me and I don't know it? Sometimes she gets really mad and won't talk to me for a long time. Sometimes she even throws stuff at me.

But I still love her. Am I sick in the head now?

Do I need intervention?

What should I do?

I guess I gotta buy the book....

What if it's not abuse? What if it's something else? What if it will iron out? What if she's just imitating something she thought was normal behavior that she saw in a movie or something? What if she's just wanting to be dramatic?

I guess I won't know until I buy the book?

But what if I'm getting suckered? What if I wouldn't have thought anything was seriously wrong until I heard all this stuff? What if I'm just wanting attention and sympathy?

I have to just be honest. I hate this emotional stuff. I would hate to read a whole book about this subject. I'm not fully convinced reading this book will do anything to help the problem. Why not just have a web site with all the instructions that you need to take of the problem?

But if this book is so important, why not let people read it free on the web? That's what I don't get

This is weird.

[bonnie]

Ginge,

At one time I was under the mistaken idea this could be changed if only people knew. I lost that illusion a long time ago. The best we can hope for is those like Mabel Dunbar to pick up as many pieces as possible and call it good.
Hopefully if Mabel Dunbar just plain burns out there will be others to attmept to fill her shoes.

The vast majority of members simply don't care. It is far more interesting to question your motives and concern than to give a fig about those that are so badly harmed.

[calvin]

You need to get over your frustration.  A shameless promotion for your book or taking people on a guilt trip for not buying it won't sell any.  I admire your passion for this issue of spouse abuse and it is important, but don't expect everyone to share your passion. There are many important issues in the church and many independent church ministries besides Polly's Place.   

[bonnie]

You need to get over your frustration.  A shameless promotion for your book or taking people on a guilt trip for not buying it won't sell any.  I admire your passion for this issue of spouse abuse and it is important, but don't expect everyone to share your passion. There are many important issues in the church and many independent church ministries besides Polly's Place.   

Calvin
I don't believe there is any monetary reward for Ginge.
There are many important issues within the church. No one is suggesting that one issue be the focus to the exclusion of all others.
For those that frequent the forums,and I believe those are indicative of who is sitting in the pew next to you ,everything seems to be important to the exclusion of this.
As far as I know there is only one Polly's Place in the work she is trying to do. She cannot do it alone,nor is it something than can be effectively taken care of with a words and nod and then onto the next.

On any forum you can find interest in topics that go for 10-50 pages. Active participation in the approval of wearing jewelry or something similar to the disapproval of wearing jewelry.

To me the difference in the participation of those type of issues as oppossed to this,is in the other issues little effort and work is involved. Just a chance to see your name publically on a post.
No putting yourself(general) out there. No active participation,and we really don't believe it anyway.

I can't think of any ministry that does the work of Polly's Place, I think part of the lack of interest and support for the work she is doing is to make it go away by ignoring .To acknowledge what she is doing by financial or verbal interest means we have a problem. We do not want this problem. So we blame the messenger for invading our comfort zone.

This is essentially a exercise in banging your head into a concrete wall.  As long as the member in the pew continues to resent or ignore the messenger,the leaders of the denomination do not have to change or be pro-active in this problem.
Instead of leading in stopping abuse of spouse/children by family members/predator pastors/teachers, we can't even grab the tail. Many christian denominations are miles ahead of the SDA

[scratsmom]

Even though there may be only one Polly's Place, there are many individuals out there who understand the issues involved and are quietly working to educate and assist victims of spousal abuse. You will always have scoffers and detractors, but the very nature of abuse, especially in ministry or conservative families, means it will be done behind closed doors and in secret. Women who are victims, in my experience, are often not ready to even read a book. It is like being in a cave all your life, totally dark, and even a tiny flashlight hurts your eyes. They are not ready to step out into the bright sun and will resist efforts to bring them out into the light. Education has to gradual and incremental and done over and over and over. Often quietly at first to avoid rousing the ire of the abuser until the victim is ready to take a stand.

I don't know the people involved in the book, but please don't give up. And don't assume that because everyone doesn't get on the bandwagon that what you are doing is not important or making an impact. Those who do read it may reach out to many who would not.

[princessdi]

Truth is that GC is not going to treat this issue any differently than it treats homosexuality---to pretend it doesn't happen in our church.  Mainly because, they would have to go through and adopted comprehensive policies for the pastors and adminitrators who are guilty of abuse--physical and sexual.  For now it is case by case, but unless it gets a significant amount of "discussion" amongst the laity, they will simply move the pastor/administrator, put him on some kind of "probationary period" and let it go at that.  Oh, besides convincing hte wife not to leave for the sake of his "career"  Senn it too many times!

In short, they would have to admit there was a problem first.  They have begun--late and wrong--but there is a beginning at least.  That is why ministries such as Polly's Place are so vital, until GC gets a clue. 

[Ginge]

I am NOT frustrated anymore, thanks to you girls insights and giving me a few props.

Last night on Club Adventist we had a three way Interview with me (Virginia) my husband Bob and Mable Dunbar of Polly's Place it was handled very well and there were many questions posted that were answered.  It is still up if you are interested in who we really are and what we are about.  We really are quite nice people if you care to get acquainted with us and I promise not to try and sell you our book (even if it is a good one).      smile

Virginia