Advent Talk
Issues & Concerns Category => 3ABN => Topic started by: Artiste on March 12, 2008, 10:35:50 PM
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It has been proposed that the subpoena served by 3ABN/Danny Shelton on bluehost to turn over information on certain AdventTalk posters might be largely for the purposes of harrassment and intimidation.
This is outrageous!
AdventTalk was established to uphold Seventh-day Adventist Church truths and standards, provide an online community for Christian fellowship, and to respectfully discuss and look for solutions for the 3ABN problems that have been so well documented in the past and continue to fester under cover.
Posters such as Elder Johann Thorvaldsson do not deserve such treatment! Pastor Thorvaldsson has served the Seventh-day Adventist Church during his lifetime as minister, counselor, and missionary and is now retired. Is this the time to subject him to such unwarranted stress and indignity?
Sister is also one who has contributed much to our understanding of the etiology of the 3ABN problems.
The CALL TO ACTION:
We must make our best effort to open up to the Adventist public every action and hidden maneuver of the 3ABN/Danny Shelton machine and any individuals or entities behind it.
Fran, you have done so much to bring to light unsavory financial information. Please continue to remind us of those things in your posts.
Snoopy, your trenchant comments and analyses are always needed!
Gailon, it would be largely impossible for us to be where we are now without your work. Please give us more of your imformative posts.
And Inga, your hard-hitting and incisive communications have hit the spot! Daryl is also invaluable here as well as the rest of our fellow posters, you know who you are!
As you may have noticed, BlackSDA is no longer open casual readers and browsers looking for the latest information on 3ABN issues.
It is left for us to carry the torch and provide up-to-date news for the Adventist public!
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As you may have noticed, BlackSDA is no longer open casual readers and browsers looking for the latest information on 3ABN issues.
No, I haven't notice. I'm reading there right now. What do you mean? (Of course, I'm a member and not a "casual reader.")
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BlackSDA has shut down its access to the many who have come by on a regular basis to check on the latest 3ABN news without registering as a member. This happened in the last couple of days or so and appears to be the same for all the forums on BSDA.
If you log out and then attempt to read posts, you will only be able to access the first one in a section.
The implication for us here on AdventTalk is that we now carry the responsibility to dissiminate regular, daily online information on 3ABN issues.
3ABN promoters who are opposing us are no doubt happy with this development, if indeed they didn't precipitate it themselves, because it slows the flow of information, just as buying the Save3ABN site was supposed to have done.
If they can now intimidate us here at AdventTalk by their subpoena or other means to curtail our posting, they will have one of their objectives accomplished.
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Maybe it's time for folks like Fran, who have posted a lot of important info at BlackSDA, to bring it here as well.
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Believe me, this has strengthened my resolve!!! These brutes of due process must be punished in ways we have so far deliberately withheld. Let the four winds descend upon them and let them feel the full affect of their conduct and violation of due process, infamous retaliation and infliction of defamation.
They must now feel the full weight of every available due process to bring the weight of the law upon them. Every available and legitimate process must be used to bring justice to the victims and their claims, regardless of the cost to 3ABN. 3ABN continues to coddle and support this conduct and, unfortunately,
must learn the price that this must neccasarily inflict.
And we must preserve the absolute rights implicit in the First Amendment!!!
Are you ready to put your full effort into this battle? Will you actually take a stand to defeat and roll back this tyranny? Will you help the victims and work to make it possible for them to pursue their claims??? Or just clap from the sidelines???
This is a war with many fronts and we will need dedicated effort to help these people to achieve their due process rights.
Gailon Arthur Joy
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Maybe it's time for folks like Farn, who have posted a lot of important info at BlackSDA, to bring it here as well.
Here, Here!!! I second that motion. If BSDA has lost it's nerves, then let Advent Talk become the repository for the Truth, the Whole Truth and nothing but the Truth.
Gailon Arthur Joy
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Can someone help me out here. I have only our own experience to draw on.
In the beginning of ours we knew that many issues can arise out of a lawsuit. Both sides can get bloody. If you have something to hide, you can rest assurred it will come back to bite. Not sure if I am making this clear or not
During my desposition I made a statement when asked when I knew of something I had said to my husband. I was cautioned immediately to not reference anyone in that way as they likely could then face a desposition on that issue themselves. Rather than say I told my husband on such and such a day,it would be wiser to say I knew on ????
How will this impact those of the oppossing side?? If member A of any forum interacts and opposses member B and responds with another story? What if member A says when member B told me ??? Memebr A and B are both under assumed names. By referencing and using what one member said to another as part of what is being used for the cause of deposition, would then it be possible to bring both to the table for their real name and documentation of what was said.
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Maybe it's time for folks like Fran, who have posted a lot of important info at BlackSDA, to bring it here as well.
It would be very helpful for Fran to begin posting here on AdventTalk the financial information she has obtained.
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BlackSDA has shut down its access to the many who have come by on a regular basis to check on the latest 3ABN news without registering as a member. This happened in the last couple of days or so and appears to be the same for all the forums on BSDA.
If you log out and then attempt to read posts, you will only be able to access the first one in a section.
The implication for us here on AdventTalk is that we now carry the responsibility to dissiminate regular, daily online information on 3ABN issues.
3ABN promoters who are opposing us are no doubt happy with this development, if indeed they didn't precipitate it themselves, because it slows the flow of information, just as buying the Save3ABN site was supposed to have done.
If they can now intimidate us here at AdventTalk by their subpoena or other means to curtail our posting, they will have one of their objectives accomplished.
As of today, it appears that BlackSDA has reopened its forums to guests who are coming by to get information. This is a good move on Calvin's part.
I believe that we here on AdventTalk also need to continue to present all the information for the viewing public that we possibly can in order to promote knowledge of 3ABN's actions.
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This was merely a tease to encourage more lurkers to join and post. Something I do from time to time.
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Anyway, glad that you reopened it, Calvin! :)
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This was merely a tease to encourage more lurkers to join and post. Something I do from time to time.
Calvin, you are something else!
Have a blessed and peaceful Sabbath!
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Maybe we should do some of that teaser stuff here! :D
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Calvin announces on BSDA that he has hired a lawyer and that he is resisting the subpoena. Great! How do we tackle it here?
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File a motion to quash in Utah or a motion for a protective order in Massachusetts, if BlueHost is not resisting the subpoena.
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Good question!
I wonder if Bob, Gailon, or Gregory, or even Calvin himself can answer that one for us?
It is somewhat different here, seeing it is Bluehost that was served and not Advent Talk itself.
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I have sent two emails to abuse@bluehost.com but have yet to receive a response.
Calvin announces on BSDA that he has hired a lawyer and that he is resisting the subpoena. Great! How do we tackle it here?
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I have sent two emails to abuse@bluehost.com but have yet to receive a response.
Calvin announces on BSDA that he has hired a lawyer and that he is resisting the subpoena. Great! How do we tackle it here?
I have also sent an email to abuse@bluehost.com a few days ago and have not received a response.
Sister
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How many are responding to the abuse e-mail. I am getting mine ready to send. Any advice on specifics to use
Bonnie
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Calvin announces on BSDA that he has hired a lawyer and that he is resisting the subpoena. Great! How do we tackle it here?
Provide Calvin with every inch of support to which he is entitled, including the raising of funds!!!. If you have a common interest, you form a common bond and put your resources together to challenge every invasion of constitutional right.
And publicize the insidious process that 3ABN has undertaken. Give them all the publicity they deserve.
Get organized, folks...stand shoulder to shoulder and march straight ahead!!! Let the reserves watch the flanks. They obviously cannot stand the heat. SO...TURN IT UP TEN NOTCHES FOR EVERY ONE!!! That means you are twenty behind!!!
There time is coming!!! Each and every one!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
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It sounds like Calvin is already getting donations for his legal expenses!
As far as publicizing the 3ABN processes,we appear to be doing that successfully enough to cause their subpoena lists to materialize!
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Just a suggestion. To raise money for those that are naed in the subpoena. I don't really have a dog in this fight in the sense of having any type of information stated or implied so am not really concerned about that, but others obviously have taken a strong stand.
I have been an ebay seller for years. I hear it works well for DS and 3ABN if correct.
All of us that may not have a lot of surplus cash do have a surprising number of items laying around our homes. Things we don't use but hang onto. Even for the members here to purchase items they may need and are going to buy.
A ebay seller account can be opend quickly. The process is not difficult and all proceeds,less seller fees can go directly to aid those that are now under attack. If you are upfront with description and prompt in delivery and communication,and list useful needed items, ebay can be lucrative.
For anyone that would be interested and feel this may be feasible and lacks the knowledge of how to, I will be glad to help walk you thru it.
Christian books, home school curriculum,good quality children's clothes at a reasonable price,women's clothing, many times the larger sizes, any type of collectibles, DVD's you no longer want or would be willing to sel ETC.
A member of C/A sells many EW books, a lot of older ones and from what I can see does rather well
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Just to clarify, when I say I don't have a dog in this fight, I am speaking strictly about personal information concerning 3ABN. I do not appreciate my name on the subpoena, just because someone wants to find out my ip and if in fact I may be posting under another name.
Random invasion and what appears to be a fishing expediation is a "dog in this fight"
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A ebay seller account can be opend quickly. The process is not difficult and all proceeds, less seller fees can go directly to aid those that are now under attack.
For anyone that would be interested and feel this may be feasible and lacks the knowledge of how to, I will be glad to help walk you thru it.
Thanks, bonnie, for offering that help!
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File a motion to quash in Utah or a motion for a protective order in Massachusetts, if BlueHost is not resisting the subpoena.
That would hardly be feasible where I am would it? I'm a long way away from those places. Oh well! Nothing to lose sleep over. :scratch:
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I wonder if Bob Pickle will be informed if and when the subpoena info is sent out by BlueHost.
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I wonder if anybody will be informed if and when the subpoena info is sent out by BlueHost.
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I wonder if anybody will be informed if and when the subpoena info is sent out by BlueHost.
I wonder if I will be informed that subpoenas were issued???
Gailon Arthur Joy
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Are you supposed to be informed, Gailon?
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They must now feel the full weight of every available due process to bring the weight of the law upon them. Every available and legitimate process must be used to bring justice to the victims and their claims, regardless of the cost to 3ABN. 3ABN continues to coddle and support this conduct and, unfortunately,
must learn the price that this must neccasarily inflict.
And we must preserve the absolute rights implicit in the First Amendment!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
Good point, Gailon!
Where is the new kinder, gentler 3ABN as it is said to be under Elder James Gilley?
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I wonder if anybody will be informed if and when the subpoena info is sent out by BlueHost.
I wonder if I will be informed that subpoenas were issued???
Gailon Arthur Joy
???
Filed and entered: March 13, 2008
In re ) Chapter 7, No. 07-43128-JBR
GAILON ARTHUR JOY, Debtor
Adv. Proceeding No. 07-4173
GAILON ARTHUR JOY, Plaintiff
VS
THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC., DANNY LEE SHELTON, JOHN P. PUCCI, ESQ.,
GERALD S. DUFFY, ESQ., FIERST, PUCCI & KANE, LLP, and SIEGEL BRILL GRUEPNER DUFFY & FOSTER, P.A, Defendants
2. Pursuant to an Order of this Court dated March 3, 2008 authorizing 3ABN and Shelton to conduct a Rule 2004 Examination of the Plaintiff (who is also the Debtor in the underlying Chapter 7 case), 3ABN and Shelton have issued a Subpoena for the production of documents and other information and to conduct a Rule 2004 Examination. That Examination is currently scheduled to take place on April 15, 2008. --
PACER Court Docket Entry:
"70 -- Filed & Entered: 03/03/2008 Order on Motion for Examination
Docket Text: Endorsed Order Dated 3/3/08 Granting [69] Motion filed by Creditor Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc. for 2004 Examination of Gailon Arthur Joy. ALLOWED.
NO OBJECTIONS FILED. (mbd, USBC)"
Document 69:
UNITED STATES BANKRUPTCY COURT
FOR THE DISTRICT OF MASSACHUSETTS
_______________________________ )
In re ) Chapter 7, No. 07-43128-JBR
)
GAILON ARTHUR JOY )
)
Debtor )
)
MOTION OF THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC.
FOR AN ORDER AUTHORIZING AND COMPELLING EXAMINATION OF GAILON ARTHUR JOY UNDER FEDERAL RULE OF BANKRUPTCY PROCEDURE 2004
To the HONORABLE JOEL B. ROSENTHAL, Bankruptcy Judge:
Now comes Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc., (“3ABN”), a creditor and party in interest, and hereby moves this Court for the entry of an Order authorizing 3ABN to conduct an examination of Gailon Arthur Joy (“Debtor” or “Joy”) pursuant to Federal Rule of Bankruptcy Procedure 2004 and compelling the Debtor to participate in such an examination. In support thereof, 3ABN represents as follows:
1. The above-referenced Debtor filed a Voluntary Petition in Massachusetts seeking relief under the provisions of Chapter 7 of the Bankruptcy Code on August 14, 2007 (“Petition Date”).
2. Janice G. Marsh is the duly appointed Chapter 7 Trustee in this case and continues to serve in that capacity.
3. On April 6, 2007, 3ABN and one of its founders, Danny Lee Shelton (“Shelton”), commenced an action in the U.S. District Court for the District of Massachusetts entitled Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc., an Illinois non-profit corporation and Danny Lee Shelton v. Gailon Arthur Joy and Robert Pickle, which case is pending as Case No. 4:07-cv-40098-FDS (“Civil Action”). As stated in more detail in other pleadings previously filed in this case, 3ABN is an entity founded in Illinois in the mid 1980’s to operate and manage a Christian television and radio broadcast ministry. 3ABN’s slate of programming includes both spiritual and lifestyle presentations, and it has a ministry focus of “Mending Broken People”.
4. Over the past two decades, 3ABN has spent enormous resources to promote its message and publicizing itself though advertising, live events, direct mail campaigns, and group presentations. The result of this effort is that 3ABN is now one of the larger Christian networks in North America, broadcasting 24 hour television and radio programming to viewers and listeners that are estimated to number well into the millions. In addition to its headquarters in Illinois, it also operates facilities in Russia, the Philippines and New Guinea.
5. In order to provide its programming, to retain current viewers and listeners and to attract new ones, 3ABN depends on its reputation and goodwill. Most of its operations are funded by the donations of viewers and supporters.
6. To help protect this reputation and goodwill, 3ABN has registered “3ABN” and “Three Angels Broadcasting Network” as trademarks with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. Additionally, 3ABN also has a significant internet operation, primarily through its website, www.3abn.org (targeting North American audiences), and through secondary websites www.3abnaustralia.org.au (for Australia) and www.3angels.ru (for Russia). These websites offer pastoral support, streaming audio and video programming and information about 3ABN’s mission and operations. Visitors to the websites can also purchase books and recordings produced by 3ABN and can make donations to its ministry.
7. In order to protect its trademarks and to use the 3ABN marks on the internet, 3ABN has registered over 3 dozen domain names, all of which contain the “3ABN” trademark, including but not limited to 3ABN.com, 3ABN.org, 3ABN.tv, 3ABNtelevision.com, 3ABNradio.com, 3ABNmusic.com, 3ABNbooks.com, 3ABNtv.com, and 3ABNtv.org.
8. In January 2007, 3ABN discovered that the Debtor had registered the domain name “save3ABN.com”. In March 2007, 3ABN further discovered that the Debtor had registered the domain name “save3ABN.org” and that the website at www.save3ABN.org directs visitors to the www.save3ABN.com website. These two websites that the Debtor has registered were not listed as assets in his bankruptcy schedules.
9. According to 3ABN, the website at www.save3ABN.com contains information that is antithetical to 3ABN’s message, and contains gross misstatements of fact concerning 3ABN’s actions and operations, and contains baseless and untrue allegations of criminal conduct by 3ABN, Shelton and persons involved with 3ABN, and also contains disparaging characterizations of 3ABN, its broadcast network and Shelton. 3ABN has also maintained that the Debtor embedded these websites with the metatags “3ABN”, “3-ABN”, and “Three Angels Broadcasting Network”, which are words and phrases used by internet search engines to locate websites that use 3ABN trademarks.
10. In the Civil Action, 3ABN alleges that the save3ABN.com and save3ABN.org domains and websites, as well as the use of the metatags as described above, incorporate 3ABN’s trademark that it has used continuously for over 20 years in connection with its ministry, broadcasts and audio and video programming, and as such, infringes on those trademark rights. Additionally, the Debtor’s statements on his website about 3ABN and Shelton are defamatory in nature.
11. On November 21, 2007, this Court allowed 3ABN’s Motion for Relief from Stay permitting 3ABN to, among other things, seek injunctive relief in the Civil Action to prevent the Debtor from continuing to use the 3ABN.com and 3ABN.org domains and websites, from continuing to defame and disparage 3ABN and Shelton, and from continuing to interfere with 3ABN’s business.
12. As disclosed to the Court in connection with the January 31, 2008 hearing in this case that took place on the sale of the domain names 3ABN.com and 3ABN.org from the Trustee to 3ABN, it appears that the domain names may have been transferred to entities controlled by Robert Pickle, the Debtor’s co-defendant in the Civil Action. 3ABN and Shelton believe that the Debtor and Mr. Pickle are acting in concert with respect to the various violations asserted by 3ABN and Shelton in the Civil Action.
13. Given the above-described circumstances concerning the Debtor’s ownership and alleged transfer of the domain names, 3ABN and Shelton request authority to examine the Debtor pursuant to Rule 2004 of the Federal Rules of Bankruptcy Procedure concerning his past and present ownership of any assets, claims and property rights, including domain names.
14. Pursuant to Federal Rule of Bankruptcy Procedure 2004, the Court may authorize the examination of any person on all matters pertaining to the conduct, property, liabilities and financial condition of the Debtor, or any matter which may affect the administration of the Debtor’s estate.
15. 3ABN believes that it is essential that it be authorized to examine Gailon Arthur Joy, and that he be ordered to produce documents in connection with that examination, so that 3ABN and any other party in interest, including the Chapter 7 Trustee, can:
(a) determine the status and history of the ownership by the Debtor of any assets, including internet domain names;
(b) assess the value of any assets owned, controlled or formerly owned or controlled by the Debtor;
(c) determine the extent of any transfers between the Debtor and any other parties, to assess whether the estate has any avoidance of other rights arising from said transfers; and
(d) obtain information on any other matter, including, but not limited to, past, present and anticipated income sources.
The documents, data, and information that will be requested will include, but are not limited to, the categories of items described on the attached Exhibit “A”.
16. If the relief requested herein is granted, 3ABN shall extend an invitation to the Chapter 7 Trustee to participate in any examination to be conducted. 3ABN will assume the financial responsibility of transcription and other expenses associated with the examination with the exception of those incurred by the Debtor. Furthermore, 3ABN proposes that such examination take place at the offices of Hendel & Collins, P.C., 101 State Street, Springfield, Massachusetts.
WHEREFORE, 3ABN respectfully requests the entry of an Order authorizing and compelling the immediate examination of the Debtor and directing the Debtor to produce documents, data and information to be requested by 3ABN which shall pertain to the Debtor’s financial affairs, including, but not limited to, the categories of items described on the attached Exhibit “A”.
THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC.
Dated: February 15, 2008
By: /s/ George I. Roumeliotis
JOSEPH B. COLLINS, ESQ.
(BBO#092660)
GEORGE I. ROUMELIOTIS, ESQ.
(BBO#564943)
For HENDEL & COLLINS, P.C.
101 State Street
Springfield, MA 01103
Tel. (413) 734-6411
groumeliotis@hendelcollins.com
Y:\uSERS\clIENT\three\Motion for Rule 2004 exam.doc
Exhibit “A”
Document, Data and Information Categories
1. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership, registration, hosting, billing, appraisal, value or transfer of, or relationship among, any internet domain names ever registered in the name of the Debtor or Robert Pickle, or any entity of which the Debtor or Robert Pickle is or was a shareholder, officer or director. Such internet domain names include, but are not limited to “save3abn.com”, “save3abn.org”, “save-3abn.com”, “save-3abn.org” and the information sought includes data relating to the pointing by one or more of said domain names to any other domain names or websites.
2. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership, transfer, appraisal or value of any real estate ever owned by the Debtor or any business or entity of which the Debtor is or was a shareholder, owner, officer or director.
3. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership or transfer of any bank, brokerage, financial, or retirement accounts ever owned by the Debtor or any business or entity of which the Debtor is or was a shareholder, owner, officer or director.
4. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership, operation, value or appraisal of any businesses, whether incorporated or not, in which the Debtor has or had any ownership, beneficial or equity ownership, or of which the Debtor is or was an officer or director, including, but not limited to, appraisals, financial statements, closing statements, invoices, check registers, bank account statements, balance sheets, and reports.
5. Federal and state tax returns for the 2005 and all subsequent tax years prepared or filed by the Debtor and/or any business or entity in which the Debtor is or was a shareholder, owner, officer or director.
6. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that describes or evidences any income or gifts received by the Debtor from any and all sources from January 1, 2005 to the present, and that describes or evidences any income or gifts that the Debtor anticipates receiving in the future.
7. Any persons known to the Debtor to have knowledge of, or who have participated in, any transfer or registration of any of the assets (including domain names) or who may have copies of any documents described in Categories 1 through 6 above.
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Cindy, as you have done before, you have misinterpreted what has been stated. Gailon maintains that he was never served by Plaintiffs' counsel a copy of the subpoena to BlueHost, or a copy of the first subpoena served on Calvin.
I never received from their counsel a copy of the first subpoena served on Calvin.
What you posted is totally irrelevant to the question Gailon raised.
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Filed and entered: March 13, 2008
In re ) Chapter 7, No. 07-43128-JBR
GAILON ARTHUR JOY, Debtor
Adv. Proceeding No. 07-4173
GAILON ARTHUR JOY, Plaintiff
VS
THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC., DANNY LEE SHELTON, JOHN P. PUCCI, ESQ.,
Motion filed by Creditor Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc. for 2004 Examination of Gailon Arthur Joy.
The whole 3ABN/Shelton maneuver re the bankruptcy proceedings is utterly absurd. How can they by party to the bankruptcy proceedings when Gailon does not owe them anything? In what possible way are 3ABN/Dan Shelton "creditors" of Gailon Joy?
Did they lend him money?
Did they sell him something for which he did not pay?
If their claims are not eventually thrown right out of court, it will be evident that the American justice system is more "broken" than I had imagined.
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The problem in the BK is no longer issues relating to Save3ABN, or any sums that they believe we owe them, although they would like to think there is. It is the fact that we filed an adversarial proceeding in the US Bk Court against 3ABN, DLS and Atty's Pucci, Hayes and Duffy, their Attorneys.
In other words they are being sued in this action: In Re: Gailon Arthur Joy -VS-
3ABN, DLS, Pucci, Hayes & Duffy for their actions in the US BK court. This is just the first of at least three legal counter-offensives against 3ABN, DLS, et al, directors, officers and members, and thier various counsel and consultants, which must be undertaken to let 3ABN, its Officers and Directors, most specifically Garwin McNeilus, know what their limits really are. An essential part of this process to guarantee that none others that come after ever shall have to worry about misuse of process claims from these miscreants of due process.
In fact we are contemplating venue for one such action this very evening.
Actually, the US District Court Judge in Benton and his Judge Magistrate seem to be quite conservative- one is a Reagan Appointee and the other a Bush 41 appointee. They tend to stay away from "legislating from the bench" and follow
the law. It just may be a good venue for at least one such challenge.
Of course we will also have to enforce the Auditors Subpoena there, as well. And keep in mind, now that the Judge has ordered the production of the bank statements, add this to the Auditors paperwork and then the documents from
Remnant and we will have a pretty complete picture including where to find that $10,000 check they keep insisting never happened that went to Tommy Shelton. That is the one we have statements from three people claiming it happened, one actually saw the original check. The most important reason to produce it is that it goes to the credibility of the plaintiffs and Tommy Shelton.
In any event, justice will be served and just give it time. The BK will be evaporated in time, again patience is in order. We will have the evidence we need to easily defend ourselves and we will have our basis for our own counterclaims soon enough. Everything takes time and needs to be done methodically and purposely.
Perhaps, Bob, we should send Ian a copy of the Adversarial Proceeding...oh yeah, she clearly has access to PACER and can get it herself!!!
Ian, in time it will be your turn!!! You are such a fruitbowl full of information and opinion that we cannot let the opportunity to question you and your mother go without giving you your day in the limelight. And the opportunity to give us your explanation for the evidence. It will be an "in minitaure" version of the final judgement... the evidence flashes before your eyes and you suddenly realize just how wrong you have been...will you confess all and turn upon those who have mislead you or will you stand in the judgement hall defiant against the preponderance of the evidence to the bitter end???
In the interim, we will continue to pray for you, as we should all pray for each other. This is, after all, an unfortunate conflict that could most readilly have been resolved directly with the board or before ASI...but the terms of accountability were just too difficult for the pride of 3ABN or its Directors and officers to accept. They have opted for the sword of litigation and they shall die by the sword of litigation. And the TRUTH will be known!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
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The problem in the BK is no longer issues relating to Save3ABN, or any sums that they believe we owe them, although they would like to think there is. It is the fact that we filed an adversarial proceeding in the US Bk Court against 3ABN, DLS and Atty's Pucci, Hayes and Duffy, their Attorneys.
In other words they are being sued in this action: In Re: Gailon Arthur Joy -VS-
3ABN, DLS, Pucci, Hayes & Duffy for their actions in the US BK court. This is just the first of at least three legal counter-offensives against 3ABN, DLS, et al, directors, officers and members, and thier various counsel and consultants, which must be undertaken to let 3ABN, its Officers and Directors, most specifically Garwin McNeilus, know what their limits really are. An essential part of this process to guarantee that none others that come after ever shall have to worry about misuse of process claims from these miscreants of due process.
In fact we are contemplating venue for one such action this very evening.
Actually, the US District Court Judge in Benton and his Judge Magistrate seem to be quite conservative- one is a Reagan Appointee and the other a Bush 41 appointee. They tend to stay away from "legislating from the bench" and follow
the law. It just may be a good venue for at least one such challenge.
Of course we will also have to enforce the Auditors Subpoena there, as well. And keep in mind, now that the Judge has ordered the production of the bank statements, add this to the Auditors paperwork and then the documents from
Remnant and we will have a pretty complete picture including where to find that $10,000 check they keep insisting never happened that went to Tommy Shelton. That is the one we have statements from three people claiming it happened, one actually saw the original check. The most important reason to produce it is that it goes to the credibility of the plaintiffs and Tommy Shelton.
In any event, justice will be served and just give it time. The BK will be evaporated in time, again patience is in order. We will have the evidence we need to easily defend ourselves and we will have our basis for our own counterclaims soon enough. Everything takes time and needs to be done methodically and purposely.
Perhaps, Bob, we should send Ian a copy of the Adversarial Proceeding...oh yeah, she clearly has access to PACER and can get it herself!!!
Ian, in time it will be your turn!!! You are such a fruitbowl full of information and opinion that we cannot let the opportunity to question you and your mother go without giving you your day in the limelight. And the opportunity to give us your explanation for the evidence. It will be an "in minitaure" version of the final judgement... the evidence flashes before your eyes and you suddenly realize just how wrong you have been...will you confess all and turn upon those who have mislead you or will you stand in the judgement hall defiant against the preponderance of the evidence to the bitter end???
In the interim, we will continue to pray for you, as we should all pray for each other. This is, after all, an unfortunate conflict that could most readilly have been resolved directly with the board or before ASI...but the terms of accountability were just too difficult for the pride of 3ABN or its Directors and officers to accept. They have opted for the sword of litigation and they shall die by the sword of litigation. And the TRUTH will be known!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
There has been no public posts, replies, nor worries expressed here despite the fact that Joy has been asked to provide so much more info in his subpoena,then BSDA, or even bluehost was asked for in their subpoenas regarding you all, and the mirror save 3abn sites... and that did engender so many comments and questions and opinions..
Doesn't that seem strange? It does to me. I can't help but think it does to the readers here also...
Doesn't anyone wonder why neither Pickle or Joy has explained this subpoena or examination, or posted what happened at Joy's examination yesterday, or told you what info he handed over about you all, or how he instead fought this on your behalf?
It's true I do have access to PACER, and there is zero, zip, nada zilch, regarding Gailon Joy fighting or resisting his subpoena despite all his words and claims here about what others should do, and even about your rights and how you should all join him in a suit, etc...
And despite his claims and calls for making all known, and being accountable, do you know where the money has gone or how it has been applied since you all started trying to help what you thought was a worthy cause?
Maybe you should all ask... and ask for documentation to prove it. He's accountable to you "stockholders" and any others who inquire, according to his own standards. The books should be open , right?
I would just like to add here that despite all Joy's threats against myself, and others ( including my Mom, who he keeps trying to bring into this. Give me a break!) and intimidation techniques. I have always been upfront and honest about where I get information and where it is doccumented, and stated when it is my opinion and what it is based on.
So my opinions:
If Joy wants to depose me, or sue me or whatever, I could care less....
His money his time, his loss... I just can't understand why you all see threats in everything, and don't batt an eyelash when your side keeps making threats...
BUT as far as his claims about me being possibly deposed goes, and that being a in minature version of the final judgment?? I must protest most strongly! That's just flat out arrogant and blasphemous! In my opinion Joy needs to get down off that judgment seat of Christ, and stop pretending to be like the most high.
In addition: as far as his adversarial proceedings go? well you all say you shouldn't sue the brethren... (remember that?)
and it's already been dismissed once because he couldn't and didn't prove his case. He appealed, amended his complaint. I guess we'll see what happens next...
If he continues to keep you uniformed and in the dark? well as long as I am allowed to post here, I'll keep you updated. :D
Blessings,
"the fruitbowl"
edit note
"it's already been dismissed once because he couldn't and didn't prove his case. He appealed." was incorrect. I apologise.
I should have said
"it's already been dismissed once because he couldn't and didn't prove his case. He amended his complaint" I edited my post above to reflect that.
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I'll reply to one point.
Why should Gailon fight the subpoena if he had nothing to hide?
Perhaps if he had, he could have saved 3ABN from paying yet another plane ticket for Jerrie Hayes.
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I'll reply to one point.
Why should Gailon fight the subpoena if he had nothing to hide?
...
Dear Readers and Members,
Is this a legitimate question or point?
Ask yourselves this.
Is Calvin fighting his/BSDA's subpoena because he has something to hide, or because he is concerned about your rights, and being accountable as a forum owner to his members?
Did you all protest and get upset about your login info and id's being subpoena'd from Calvin/BSDA and Blue host because you have something to hide, or for some other reason?
Why aren't those things equally important when it come's to subpoenas issued to Gailon Joy?
Bob seems to be saying Joy has nothing to hide and no reason to fight it.. even though it may include info, emails, etc from or about some or even alot of you.. my opinion.
If you have a problem with this, then I suggest that problem is with Pickle and Joy, not myself, as I only noticed what I see as an inconsistancy and double standard here.
You all, or some of you may disagree...
Your choice.
~ Ian
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No, I don't think it is the same.
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I'll reply to one point.
Why should Gailon fight the subpoena if he had nothing to hide?
Perhaps if he had, he could have saved 3ABN from paying yet another plane ticket for Jerrie Hayes.
That's exactly why I'm not making any effort to fight my information being revealed, either. I have nothing to hide. This whole idea of threatening people into silence is a huge joke, and it does nothing except reveal the desperation that the 3ABN crowd is experiencing.
My prediction is that this will backfire on them big time.
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I'll reply to one point.
Why should Gailon fight the subpoena if he had nothing to hide?
Perhaps if he had, he could have saved 3ABN from paying yet another plane ticket for Jerrie Hayes.
That's exactly why I'm not making any effort to fight my information being revealed, either. I have nothing to hide. This whole idea of threatening people into silence is a huge joke, and it does nothing except reveal the desperation that the 3ABN crowd is experiencing.
My prediction is that this will backfire on them big time.
Yes Duane. My sentiments exactly! 3abn's. Intimidation and threats is their usual mode of operation.
-
I'll reply to one point.
Why should Gailon fight the subpoena if he had nothing to hide?
...
Dear Readers and Members,
Is this a legitimate question or point?
Ask yourselves this.
Is Calvin fighting his/BSDA's subpoena because he has something to hide, or because he is concerned about your rights, and being accountable as a forum owner to his members?
Did you all protest and get upset about your login info and id's being subpoena'd from Calvin/BSDA and Blue host because you have something to hide, or for some other reason?
Why aren't those things equally important when it come's to subpoenas issued to Gailon Joy?
Bob seems to be saying Joy has nothing to hide and no reason to fight it.. even though it may include info, emails, etc from or about some or even alot of you.. my opinion.
If you have a problem with this, then I suggest that problem is with Pickle and Joy, not myself, as I only noticed what I see as an inconsistancy and double standard here.
You all, or some of you may disagree...
Your choice.
~ Ian
Would you like me to post what I gave to the miscreants who pretend they have standing as CREDITORS? I should be most happy too...Best defined as proof prima faciae that I have nothing to hide. I'll even post my responses if you feel it would be valuable to your argument. ANd why have you not? Afraid of the contents?
In fact, after reviewing the documents provided, your grand legal team was questionless and seemed completely stuck on the unavailability of bank statements but did include a complete ledger going back three years. You want bank statements, do what we did and subpoena them from the bank, that's what we did and Danny's bank has an order to produce. They fought and lost, due to that Rule 45...try it, you may like it.
And, explain to me why after spending an hour and a half of reviewing documents the best they could do was not ask a single question? With all those documents and not a single question? After all it was a 2004 Examination...you know, where a CREDITOR gets to conduct an examination to see if he can find additional assets. Assets that were supposedly hidden. Something your side is pretty good at. And something we are pretty good at tracking.
All those millions on your team amd you couldn't find anything else? Maybe because it simply does not exist and is a waste of your time and legal fees. So, keep up the great work, super slooths!!!
The best part would be the e-mails that were sent to me from that the 3ABN Chairman. Most revealing at just what a mis-guided human being he is. I will be happy to share his idealogy for the world to see, if you think it would be helpful.
So let me know if you would like me to post them, one at an agonizing time, for you to view and comment on. Be careful, you could become speechless again and Walt would probably not be so happy but I will let you be the decision here. Why not step into another mine field!!!
Other than Walt, there was virtually nothing in any of them to hide and nothing that would be violative of anyones privacy. They asked questions and I answered them and most have already been addressed here. Open and transparent is foreign to 3ABN and its board but a rule of thumb here!!! Just don't get it, huh???
Now to the question of why you and your mom are worth deposing? Because you have a wealth of information and some of it is likely very helpful to our case. You see, if you know what you claim to know, then you know a lot more, including the incriminating information, that we need to know as part of the defense. You are the self incriminator that has made it pattently clear that you have insider info and if you do, then you know the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. They call you adversarial witnesses and worthy of examination. Just never know what one will find out.
No-one can be as delusional as you claim to be and not be immediate family without having very incriminating evidence...right IAN?
Good to see you back and I so enjoy sparring with you. It is such a Joy!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
=====
Edited to remove strong and unacceptable language per reported post decision by staff.
-
Would you like me to post what I gave to the miscreants who pretend they have standing as CREDITORS? I should be most happy too...Best defined as proof prima faciae that I have nothing to hide. I'll even post my responses if you feel it would be valuable to your argument. ANd why have you not? Afraid of the contents?
In fact, after reviewing the documents provided, your grand legal team was questionless and seemed completely stuck on the unavailability of bank statements but did include a complete ledger going back three years. You want bank statements, do what we did and subpoena them from the bank, that's what we did and Danny's bank has an order to produce. They fought and lost, due to that Rule 45...try it, you may like it.
And, explain to me why after spending an hour and a half of reviewing documents the best they could do was not ask a single question? With all those documents and not a single question? After all it was a 2004 Examination...you know, where a CREDITOR gets to conduct an examination to see if he can find additional assets. Assets that were supposedly hidden. Something your side is pretty good at. And something we are pretty good at tracking.
All those millions on your team amd you couldn't find anything else? Maybe because it simply does not exist and is a waste of your time and legal fees. So, keep up the great work, super slooths!!!
The best part would be the e-mails that were sent to me from that the 3ABN Chairman. Most revealing at just what a mis-guided human being he is. I will be happy to share his idealogy for the world to see, if you think it would be helpful.
So let me know if you would like me to post them, one at an agonizing time, for you to view and comment on. Be careful, you could become speechless again and Walt would probably not be so happy but I will let you be the decision here. Why not step into another mine field!!!
Other than Walt, there was virtually nothing in any of them to hide and nothing that would be violative of anyones privacy. They asked questions and I answered them and most have already been addressed here. Open and transparent is foreign to 3ABN and its board but a rule of thumb here!!! Just don't get it, huh???
Now to the question of why you and your mom are worth deposing? Because you have a wealth of information and some of it is likely very helpful to our case. You see, if you know what you claim to know, then you know a lot more, including the incriminating information, that we need to know as part of the defense. You are the self incriminator that has made it pattently clear that you have insider info and if you do, then you know the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. They call you adversarial witnesses and worthy of examination. Just never know what one will find out.
No-one can be as delusional as you claim to be and not be immediate family without having very incriminating evidence...right IAN?
Good to see you back and I so enjoy sparring with you. It is such a Joy!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
Excellent post, Gailon. :TY:
I've heard big talk like Ian's for years. It has always been Danny's MO. The problem is that no one ever challenged it to the degree that you and Bob have. They're not used to it and it's driving them crazy.
Ian also doesn't seem to realize that as long as she and the other 3ABNites keep quiet, the rest of us usually do as well. Anyone can look and see I have posted very little on this board since joining. If Ian wants to start the discussion up again though, I can do that, too.
I just hope they realize the jig's up before it destroys the whole network.
======
Edited quote post to conform edit done in original post.
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There has been no public posts, replies, nor worries expressed here despite the fact that Joy has been asked to provide so much more info in his subpoena,then BSDA, or even bluehost was asked for in their subpoenas regarding you all, and the mirror save 3abn sites... and that did engender so many comments and questions and opinions..
Doesn't that seem strange? It does to me. I can't help but think it does to the readers here also...
Cindy, if it is so strange, why have other readers not noted that point also? Or, does it indicate that other readers do not have a problem with it? Maybe, not many others think as you do? :dunno:
edited for formatting :)
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I have still have not received notice that they have decided to Subpoena BlackSDA documents as they said they were going to do. Did they forget to serve a copy upon us? :dunno:
Anyone else hear anything about this brewing battle?
Maybe Ian has an update for us?
Gailon Arthur Joy
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I have still have not received notice that they have decided to Subpoena BlackSDA documents as they said they were going to do. Did they forget to serve a copy upon us? :dunno:
Anyone else hear anything about this brewing battle?
Maybe Ian has an update for us?
Gailon Arthur Joy
With the information requested by the subpoena to Bluehost provided by Bluehost to 3ABN lawyers some time ago, what can we conclude if BlackSDA info is not being followed up on?
What about the public defender lawyer (is that the correct term?) for first ammendment rights?
Is this additional information besides the original data requested on the list of BlackSDA posters?
-
I have still have not received notice that they have decided to Subpoena BlackSDA documents as they said they were going to do. Did they forget to serve a copy upon us? :dunno:
Anyone else hear anything about this brewing battle?
Maybe Ian has an update for us?
Gailon Arthur Joy
With the information requested by the subpoena to Bluehost provided by Bluehost to 3ABN lawyers some time ago, what can we conclude if BlackSDA info is not being followed up on?
What about the public defender lawyer (is that the correct term?) for first ammendment rights?
Is this additional information besides the original data requested on the list of BlackSDA posters?
What information exactly, did they get from Bluehost?
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And keep in mind, now that the Judge has ordered the production of the bank statements, add this to the Auditors paperwork and then the documents from
Remnant and we will have a pretty complete picture including where to find that $10,000 check they keep insisting never happened that went to Tommy Shelton. That is the one we have statements from three people claiming it happened, one actually saw the original check. The most important reason to produce it is that it goes to the credibility of the plaintiffs and Tommy Shelton.
Gailon Arthur Joy
**************************************************
Yes, that certainly would damage their credibility!
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I have still have not received notice that they have decided to Subpoena BlackSDA documents as they said they were going to do. Did they forget to serve a copy upon us? :dunno:
Anyone else hear anything about this brewing battle?
Maybe Ian has an update for us?
Gailon Arthur Joy
With the information requested by the subpoena to Bluehost provided by Bluehost to 3ABN lawyers some time ago, what can we conclude if BlackSDA info is not being followed up on?
What about the public defender lawyer (is that the correct term?) for first ammendment rights?
Is this additional information besides the original data requested on the list of BlackSDA posters?
The Blue Host material was given before there was a chance to challenge. Blue Host will have to deal with any consequences regarding their rather pre-emptory compliance and breach of confidentiality.
I am not privy to what Public Citizens is doing as we are not parties. I have heard they were not happy with the subpoena to Blue Host or to Black SDA and understood they were seriously considering taking action. All this is tertiary information, again as we are not parties. BUT WE WILL BE CHEERING THEM ON!!!
BlackSDA was issued two defective Subpoena's. Each was withdrawn. They then gave us notice that they were going to issue a third and an Objection was raised. They declared their intention to proceed with yet a third subpoena, but we have not been noticed of a third subpoena.
I understand that if one is issued then a battle royal will ensue. Perhaps Calvin could shed further light on this issue.
Gailon Arthur Joy
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Just wondering if Public Citizens is following up on anything after the first contacts.
Does anyone else have information on that?
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Just wondering if Public Citizens is following up on anything after the first contacts.
Does anyone else have information on that?
They are.
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Just wondering if Public Citizens is following up on anything after the first contacts.
Does anyone else have information on that?
It will be interesting to watch the development, and see what Public Citizen will accomplish.
They are.
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I have not contacted Public Citizen, nor do I intend to, but I am behind their efforts 110%.
This gets more ridiculous by the day. More publicity may be needed to bring a stop to it.
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I have not contacted Public Citizen, nor do I intend to, but I am behind their efforts 110%.
This gets more ridiculous by the day. More publicity may be needed to bring a stop to it.
DId the Illinoisan run the Tax Appeal Article yet?
GAJ
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I have not contacted Public Citizen, nor do I intend to, but I am behind their efforts 110%.
This gets more ridiculous by the day. More publicity may be needed to bring a stop to it.
DId the Illinoisan run the Tax Appeal Article yet?
GAJ
I'm on the road through the week so I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think so. I'll try to find out.
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[quote author=Gailon Arthur Joy link=topic=184.msg3131#msg313.
I understand that if one is issued then a battle royal will ensue. Perhaps Calvin could shed further light on this issue.
Gailon Arthur Joy
[/quote]
I say this with tongue very much in cheek. Is it good strategy to reveal 'your' tactics to the en e me? I mean 'your' not Public Citizen, but shouldn't you let a surprise or two be sprung on the adversary?
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[quote author=Gailon Arthur Joy link=topic=184.msg3131#msg313.
I understand that if one is issued then a battle royal will ensue. Perhaps Calvin could shed further light on this issue.
Gailon Arthur Joy
I say this with tongue very much in cheek. Is it good strategy to reveal 'your' tactics to the en e me? I mean 'your' not Public Citizen, but shouldn't you let a surprise or two be sprung on the adversary?
[/quote]
I think the springer has already sprung.
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I have still have not received notice that they have decided to Subpoena BlackSDA documents as they said they were going to do. Did they forget to serve a copy upon us? :dunno:
Anyone else hear anything about this brewing battle?
Maybe Ian has an update for us?
Gailon Arthur Joy
The promised subpoena has not served on me....and I don't draw any conclusions from that, not yet.
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Does that preclude Public Citizen from getting involved? Or is the presence of Public Citizen preventing the subpoenas from being re-served?
-
[quote author=Gailon Arthur Joy link=topic=184.msg3131#msg313.
I understand that if one is issued then a battle royal will ensue. Perhaps Calvin could shed further light on this issue.
Gailon Arthur Joy
I say this with tongue very much in cheek. Is it good strategy to reveal 'your' tactics to the en e me? I mean 'your' not Public Citizen, but shouldn't you let a surprise or two be sprung on the adversary?
[/quote]
If the information is worth having, any battle and any casualties are worth the goal. If not, then one may want to consider carefully just how much one will pay for nothing.
That is for the "en e me" to decide. The fact that we ceded the field of battle on this issue left a clear message: "auctung minen"...and now they must find a way through or around the minefield.
It will be worth watching how an intimidation move comes back to haunt them. If I were they, I would find another way to get the information I want or come up with another intimindation tactic, such as simply filing John Doe and Jane Doe cases to get the information...so much more intimidating, although fraught with certain risks.
Gailon Arthur Joy
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I would also encourage you to check with other independant ministries and ask them if you can see their books and also report their answers back here...
Mr Joy, who as we know has a proven, not 'alleged" history of financial impropriaties (embezzlement) has so far refused to open his books up too...
I would encourage you to ask him why he doesn't lead by example and be "open and transparent" with his donors, (re Pickle- Joy defense fund) and do so.
For it appears from PACER documents, that after already being found in contempt once, he again disobeyed a court order and was less than forthcoming and prevented the 2004examination the court ordered from proceeding...
5. Furthermore, pursuant to an Order of the Court entered on March 3, 2008,
3ABN issued a Subpoena to the Debtor regarding the production of documents
and to conduct a Rule 2004 Examination. That Examination was scheduled for April 15, 2008. Notwithstanding that the Subpoena requested that documents were to be produced several days earlier, the Debtor did not produce any documents until he arrived for the April 15th Examination. Furthermore, 3ABN states that the documents the Debtor did produce were minimal and not responsive to the scope of the request. Accordingly, as 3ABN did not have any substantive documents to review, the Examination did not go forward.
3ABN is exploring its options with respect to its perception regarding the
Debtor's lack of cooperation, and the rescheduling of the Rule 2004
Examination....
Bob Pickle replies:
So are statements by 3ABN attorneys credible? Can you prove that they are?
Is this case the adversarial proceeding or the ch. 7 bankruptcy?
They seem to be very credible, as Joy testifies to himself below... And I already answered that question and provided the proof of all this previously... as is posted below...
I wonder if anybody will be informed if and when the subpoena info is sent out by BlueHost.
I wonder if I will be informed that subpoenas were issued???
Gailon Arthur Joy
???
Filed and entered: March 13, 2008
In re ) Chapter 7, No. 07-43128-JBR
GAILON ARTHUR JOY, Debtor
Adv. Proceeding No. 07-4173
GAILON ARTHUR JOY, Plaintiff
VS
THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC., DANNY LEE SHELTON, JOHN P. PUCCI, ESQ.,
GERALD S. DUFFY, ESQ., FIERST, PUCCI & KANE, LLP, and SIEGEL BRILL GRUEPNER DUFFY & FOSTER, P.A, Defendants
2. Pursuant to an Order of this Court dated March 3, 2008 authorizing 3ABN and Shelton to conduct a Rule 2004 Examination of the Plaintiff (who is also the Debtor in the underlying Chapter 7 case), 3ABN and Shelton have issued a Subpoena for the production of documents and other information and to conduct a Rule 2004 Examination. That Examination is currently scheduled to take place on April 15, 2008. --
PACER Court Docket Entry:
"70 -- Filed & Entered: 03/03/2008 Order on Motion for Examination
Docket Text: Endorsed Order Dated 3/3/08 Granting [69] Motion filed by Creditor Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc. for 2004 Examination of Gailon Arthur Joy. ALLOWED.
NO OBJECTIONS FILED. (mbd, USBC)"
Document 69:
UNITED STATES BANKRUPTCY COURT
FOR THE DISTRICT OF MASSACHUSETTS
_______________________________ )
In re ) Chapter 7, No. 07-43128-JBR
)
GAILON ARTHUR JOY )
)
Debtor )
)
MOTION OF THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC.
FOR AN ORDER AUTHORIZING AND COMPELLING EXAMINATION OF GAILON ARTHUR JOY UNDER FEDERAL RULE OF BANKRUPTCY PROCEDURE 2004
To the HONORABLE JOEL B. ROSENTHAL, Bankruptcy Judge:
Now comes Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc., (“3ABN”), a creditor and party in interest, and hereby moves this Court for the entry of an Order authorizing 3ABN to conduct an examination of Gailon Arthur Joy (“Debtor” or “Joy”) pursuant to Federal Rule of Bankruptcy Procedure 2004 and compelling the Debtor to participate in such an examination. In support thereof, 3ABN represents as follows:
1. The above-referenced Debtor filed a Voluntary Petition in Massachusetts seeking relief under the provisions of Chapter 7 of the Bankruptcy Code on August 14, 2007 (“Petition Date”).
2. Janice G. Marsh is the duly appointed Chapter 7 Trustee in this case and continues to serve in that capacity.
3. On April 6, 2007, 3ABN and one of its founders, Danny Lee Shelton (“Shelton”), commenced an action in the U.S. District Court for the District of Massachusetts entitled Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc., an Illinois non-profit corporation and Danny Lee Shelton v. Gailon Arthur Joy and Robert Pickle, which case is pending as Case No. 4:07-cv-40098-FDS (“Civil Action”). As stated in more detail in other pleadings previously filed in this case, 3ABN is an entity founded in Illinois in the mid 1980’s to operate and manage a Christian television and radio broadcast ministry. 3ABN’s slate of programming includes both spiritual and lifestyle presentations, and it has a ministry focus of “Mending Broken People”.
4. Over the past two decades, 3ABN has spent enormous resources to promote its message and publicizing itself though advertising, live events, direct mail campaigns, and group presentations. The result of this effort is that 3ABN is now one of the larger Christian networks in North America, broadcasting 24 hour television and radio programming to viewers and listeners that are estimated to number well into the millions. In addition to its headquarters in Illinois, it also operates facilities in Russia, the Philippines and New Guinea.
5. In order to provide its programming, to retain current viewers and listeners and to attract new ones, 3ABN depends on its reputation and goodwill. Most of its operations are funded by the donations of viewers and supporters.
6. To help protect this reputation and goodwill, 3ABN has registered “3ABN” and “Three Angels Broadcasting Network” as trademarks with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. Additionally, 3ABN also has a significant internet operation, primarily through its website, www.3abn.org (targeting North American audiences), and through secondary websites www.3abnaustralia.org.au (for Australia) and www.3angels.ru (for Russia). These websites offer pastoral support, streaming audio and video programming and information about 3ABN’s mission and operations. Visitors to the websites can also purchase books and recordings produced by 3ABN and can make donations to its ministry.
7. In order to protect its trademarks and to use the 3ABN marks on the internet, 3ABN has registered over 3 dozen domain names, all of which contain the “3ABN” trademark, including but not limited to 3ABN.com, 3ABN.org, 3ABN.tv, 3ABNtelevision.com, 3ABNradio.com, 3ABNmusic.com, 3ABNbooks.com, 3ABNtv.com, and 3ABNtv.org.
8. In January 2007, 3ABN discovered that the Debtor had registered the domain name “save3ABN.com”. In March 2007, 3ABN further discovered that the Debtor had registered the domain name “save3ABN.org” and that the website at www.save3ABN.org directs visitors to the www.save3ABN.com website. These two websites that the Debtor has registered were not listed as assets in his bankruptcy schedules.
9. According to 3ABN, the website at www.save3ABN.com contains information that is antithetical to 3ABN’s message, and contains gross misstatements of fact concerning 3ABN’s actions and operations, and contains baseless and untrue allegations of criminal conduct by 3ABN, Shelton and persons involved with 3ABN, and also contains disparaging characterizations of 3ABN, its broadcast network and Shelton. 3ABN has also maintained that the Debtor embedded these websites with the metatags “3ABN”, “3-ABN”, and “Three Angels Broadcasting Network”, which are words and phrases used by internet search engines to locate websites that use 3ABN trademarks.
10. In the Civil Action, 3ABN alleges that the save3ABN.com and save3ABN.org domains and websites, as well as the use of the metatags as described above, incorporate 3ABN’s trademark that it has used continuously for over 20 years in connection with its ministry, broadcasts and audio and video programming, and as such, infringes on those trademark rights. Additionally, the Debtor’s statements on his website about 3ABN and Shelton are defamatory in nature.
11. On November 21, 2007, this Court allowed 3ABN’s Motion for Relief from Stay permitting 3ABN to, among other things, seek injunctive relief in the Civil Action to prevent the Debtor from continuing to use the 3ABN.com and 3ABN.org domains and websites, from continuing to defame and disparage 3ABN and Shelton, and from continuing to interfere with 3ABN’s business.
12. As disclosed to the Court in connection with the January 31, 2008 hearing in this case that took place on the sale of the domain names 3ABN.com and 3ABN.org from the Trustee to 3ABN, it appears that the domain names may have been transferred to entities controlled by Robert Pickle, the Debtor’s co-defendant in the Civil Action. 3ABN and Shelton believe that the Debtor and Mr. Pickle are acting in concert with respect to the various violations asserted by 3ABN and Shelton in the Civil Action.
13. Given the above-described circumstances concerning the Debtor’s ownership and alleged transfer of the domain names, 3ABN and Shelton request authority to examine the Debtor pursuant to Rule 2004 of the Federal Rules of Bankruptcy Procedure concerning his past and present ownership of any assets, claims and property rights, including domain names.
14. Pursuant to Federal Rule of Bankruptcy Procedure 2004, the Court may authorize the examination of any person on all matters pertaining to the conduct, property, liabilities and financial condition of the Debtor, or any matter which may affect the administration of the Debtor’s estate.
15. 3ABN believes that it is essential that it be authorized to examine Gailon Arthur Joy, and that he be ordered to produce documents in connection with that examination, so that 3ABN and any other party in interest, including the Chapter 7 Trustee, can:
(a) determine the status and history of the ownership by the Debtor of any assets, including internet domain names;
(b) assess the value of any assets owned, controlled or formerly owned or controlled by the Debtor;
(c) determine the extent of any transfers between the Debtor and any other parties, to assess whether the estate has any avoidance of other rights arising from said transfers; and
(d) obtain information on any other matter, including, but not limited to, past, present and anticipated income sources.
The documents, data, and information that will be requested will include, but are not limited to, the categories of items described on the attached Exhibit “A”.
16. If the relief requested herein is granted, 3ABN shall extend an invitation to the Chapter 7 Trustee to participate in any examination to be conducted. 3ABN will assume the financial responsibility of transcription and other expenses associated with the examination with the exception of those incurred by the Debtor. Furthermore, 3ABN proposes that such examination take place at the offices of Hendel & Collins, P.C., 101 State Street, Springfield, Massachusetts.
WHEREFORE, 3ABN respectfully requests the entry of an Order authorizing and compelling the immediate examination of the Debtor and directing the Debtor to produce documents, data and information to be requested by 3ABN which shall pertain to the Debtor’s financial affairs, including, but not limited to, the categories of items described on the attached Exhibit “A”.
THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING NETWORK, INC.
Dated: February 15, 2008
By: /s/ George I. Roumeliotis
JOSEPH B. COLLINS, ESQ.
(BBO#092660)
GEORGE I. ROUMELIOTIS, ESQ.
(BBO#564943)
For HENDEL & COLLINS, P.C.
101 State Street
Springfield, MA 01103
Tel. (413) 734-6411
groumeliotis@hendelcollins.com
Y:\uSERS\clIENT\three\Motion for Rule 2004 exam.doc
Exhibit “A”
Document, Data and Information Categories
1. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership, registration, hosting, billing, appraisal, value or transfer of, or relationship among, any internet domain names ever registered in the name of the Debtor or Robert Pickle, or any entity of which the Debtor or Robert Pickle is or was a shareholder, officer or director. Such internet domain names include, but are not limited to “save3abn.com”, “save3abn.org”, “save-3abn.com”, “save-3abn.org” and the information sought includes data relating to the pointing by one or more of said domain names to any other domain names or websites.
2. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership, transfer, appraisal or value of any real estate ever owned by the Debtor or any business or entity of which the Debtor is or was a shareholder, owner, officer or director.
3. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership or transfer of any bank, brokerage, financial, or retirement accounts ever owned by the Debtor or any business or entity of which the Debtor is or was a shareholder, owner, officer or director.
4. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that identify or relate to the ownership, operation, value or appraisal of any businesses, whether incorporated or not, in which the Debtor has or had any ownership, beneficial or equity ownership, or of which the Debtor is or was an officer or director, including, but not limited to, appraisals, financial statements, closing statements, invoices, check registers, bank account statements, balance sheets, and reports.
5. Federal and state tax returns for the 2005 and all subsequent tax years prepared or filed by the Debtor and/or any business or entity in which the Debtor is or was a shareholder, owner, officer or director.
6. Any and all documents, data and information, whether in paper or electronic form, in the Debtor’s possession, custody or control that describes or evidences any income or gifts received by the Debtor from any and all sources from January 1, 2005 to the present, and that describes or evidences any income or gifts that the Debtor anticipates receiving in the future.
7. Any persons known to the Debtor to have knowledge of, or who have participated in, any transfer or registration of any of the assets (including domain names) or who may have copies of any documents described in Categories 1 through 6 above.
Would you like me to post what I gave to the miscreants who pretend they have standing as CREDITORS? I should be most happy too...Best defined as proof prima faciae that I have nothing to hide. I'll even post my responses if you feel it would be valuable to your argument. ANd why have you not? Afraid of the contents?
In fact, after reviewing the documents provided, your grand legal team was questionless and seemed completely stuck on the unavailability of bank statements but did include a complete ledger going back three years. You want bank statements, do what we did and subpoena them from the bank, that's what we did and Danny's bank has an order to produce. They fought and lost, due to that Rule 45...try it, you may like it.
And, explain to me why after spending an hour and a half of reviewing documents the best they could do was not ask a single question? With all those documents and not a single question? After all it was a 2004 Examination...you know, where a CREDITOR gets to conduct an examination to see if he can find additional assets. Assets that were supposedly hidden. Something your side is pretty good at. And something we are pretty good at tracking.
All those millions on your team amd you couldn't find anything else? Maybe because it simply does not exist and is a waste of your time and legal fees. So, keep up the great work, super slooths!!!
But why should they have to issue a subpoena to Joy's bank, when they already issued a subpoena to Joy, and their motion and all including his bank statements was ordered by the court???
Isn't it obvious Joy has only contempt for the attorneys the subpoena and the Judge and the court order????
It is to me...
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Can't you try to be a little more accurate when you post? The subpoenas Gailon was referring to were ones to others, not himself. I think you were already corrected on this matter once before.
Where did Gailon say the statements of the 3ABN attorneys were credible?
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Can't you try to be a little more accurate when you post? The subpoenas Gailon was referring to were ones to others, not himself. I think you were already corrected on this matter once before.
Where did Gailon say the statements of the 3ABN attorneys were credible?
Readers,
Gailon did not say the attorneys were credible, his words and actions show what they said was accurate as should be obvious by reading my post.
Despite Pickles attempt at diversion here, and casting doubts on the attorneys as being less than credible, no one this morning on this thread or the other has been discussing subpoenas to others, (and Gailon hasn't even taken part in this discussion.) Further, nothing I quoted is about subpoenas to others, it was about the subpoena to Gailon... and the court order regarding the exam of Gailon...
How is Pickle going to resolve anything with anyone when he continually takes all out of context and misinterprets what's said and then claims others aren't accurate.
How much more accurate can I get when I am providing direct quotes? He's not...
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Further, nothing I quoted is about subpoenas to others, it was about the subpoena to Gailon...
Totally false. Now was your falsehood told in ignorance or on purpose?
You quoted:
I wonder if anybody will be informed if and when the subpoena info is sent out by BlueHost.
I wonder if I will be informed that subpoenas were issued???
Gailon Arthur Joy
Gailon's statement which you quoted is about subpoenas to others, such as BlueHost and Calvin. Gailon says he didn't get either one, and I didn't get the first one to Calvin until I begged and begged for it.
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By the way, when you say that the 3ABN attorneys are credible, are you saying that Gerry Duffy was correct when he invoked common law copyright for his letter about 30 years after it was abolished anywhere within the U.S.?
And are you saying that Jerrie Hayes was correct in saying that there is no IRS criminal investigation going on, and that Greg Thompson and AppleTree were lying when they indicated otherwise?
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Ian,
It is so good to see you back. You sure liven up the show.
You remember when you accused me of appearing at the 2004 Examination by Parties that have already surrendered their prepetiotn claim (remember the stipulation?) and giving away all that information...you know, the very stuff you are now saying I did not produce?
Keep in mind that 3ABN does not have standing but we opted not contest that at the time so they could plainly see we had not hidden a thing...after all, this an asset hunt, not discovery, and here is the rule for your edification:
Rule 2004. Examination
(a) Examination on motion.
On motion of any party in interest, the court may order the examination of any entity.
(b) Scope of examination.
The examination of an entity under this rule or of the debtor under § 343 of the Code may relate only to the acts, conduct, or property or to the liabilities and financial condition of the debtor, or to any matter which may affect the administration of the debtor's estate, or to the debtor's right to a discharge. In a family farmer's debt adjustment case under chapter 12, an individual's debt adjustment case under chapter 13, or a reorganization case under chapter 11 of the Code, other than for the reorganization of a railroad, the examination may also relate to the operation of any business and the desirability of its continuance, the source of any money or property acquired or to be acquired by the debtor for purposes of consummating a plan and the consideration given or offered therefor, and any other matter relevant to the case or to the formulation of a plan.
Well, my lovely lady, I warned you at the time I was more than happy to share my response I gave to them with all of you "just to be open and transparent":
Non-parties request for 2004 Examination
Petitioners Responses to 3ABN Exhibit A:
1.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. However, to the best recollection of the Petitioner, he has no such documents.
2.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. However, to the best recollection of the Petitioner, he has no such documents.
3.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Petitioner has no such documents except the personal joint checking account of the petitioner held jointly with the petitioners wife. Petitioner has no paper work or electronic data from the joint account pre-petition.
4.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. However, petitioner was a independent contractor to New England Merchants, Corp until it’s demise in 2007. Petitioner does not recall being a licensee, officer, director, nor does the petitioner recall having a known beneficial or equity ownership.
5.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. However, petitioner has provided his copy of tax documents for 2005 and 2006 to Counsel and to the Trustee and apparently did not retain a copy. The only documents still in the petitioners possession are copied hereto.
6.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Petitioner has attached copies of 1099’s and a copy of office expense account of the petitioner from January 1, 2005 to the present that are available to the petitioner.
7.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Objection, Petitioners spouse is not a petitioner and the request clearly exceeds the Scope of Examination under FRBP Rule 2004 (b). To the degree it is relevant the spouse suffered a major coronary insult in May 2005 and has not been employed in 2006 or 2007. .
8.See answer to 5 and 6.
9.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Objection- attorney client privilege – atty work product and clearly exceeds the Scope of Examination under FRBP Rule 2004 (b).
10.See production under 6 above. Petitioner was a signatory to a joint account only and has no pre-petition account information or document to the best of his recollection.
11.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Objection, overly broad, but Petitioner will provide all documents relevant to the date of the petition to the recollection of the petitioner. No other documents are known to exist.
12.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Objection, overly broad. Petitioner does not recall any document meeting the non-parties request.
13.Objection, Petitioner reserves the right to challenge whether the Examiner is a party in interest pursuant to Rule 2004. Objection, calls for speculation. Petitioner has no recollection of any information relating to the transfer of domain names, other than the Plaintiffs’ clear instructions that the petitioner did not wish to incur any liability for the renewal of the domain name nor for the ongoing expenses of the save3ABN.com hosting and webmaster costs of operation.
So, As can be seen we produced all that we had to produce!!! And we sat for two hours while they fumed and fussed and discovered I had no hidden assets, including a ledger of accounts back to 2004. ANd after all that time, the fools never asked a single question...not even my name and address for the record. So, now it is time to eject them so we can close and dismiss the BK and get back to a fight worth fighting.
In essence, Ms Ian, you can take it to the bank that you clearly cannot trust the statements of Counsel that has been sued by this Party. The most recent statement was their failure to produce document by May 4 as promised in writing. Thus th3e reason for the motions to compel. And it will not be the last time, either!!!
By the way, any word on the board meeting the past two days? Why don't you inquire and bring us up to date so I don't have to.
Still great to see you back...you provide such an excellent platform to discredit the loyal opposition.
Gailon Arthur Joy
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BSDA has a new Subpoena pending. Time for action is dead ahead.
By the way, Ian, are you going to report on the Board Meeting of Wednesday and Thursday of last week? Better you spin it than I. You know, it has been more than 24 hours and the cracks are beginning to leak!!! Inquiring minds want to know???
Gailon Arthur Joy
PS: By the way, Can you check for me and let me know if it was the Chairman that had to break the tie? Makes for a beefier story.
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Maybe it\\\\\\\'s time for folks like Farn, who have posted a lot of important info at BlackSDA, to bring it here as well.
Here, Here!!! I second that motion. If BSDA has lost it\\\\\\\'s nerves, then let Advent Talk become the repository for the Truth, the Whole Truth and nothing but the Truth.
Gailon Arthur Joy
It would be very helpful for Fran to begin posting here on AdventTalk the financial information she has obtained.
Do not forget to include your letter here:
http://www.save-3abn.com/news-releases-irs-criminal-investigation-11-30-07.htm
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BSDA has a new Subpoena pending. Time for action is dead ahead.
Calvin posted on Blacksda yesterday that at the advice of his attorney he has complied with the subpoena.
I am rather surprised that neither Bob or you have announced that here yet.
http://www.blacksda.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21696&st=15&#entry251463
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Ummm, I guess maybe I can't read? But, would you mind telling me the words you are reading that say what you say calvin said in his post??? I'm not seeing it.
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Ummm, I guess maybe I can\'t read? But, would you mind telling me the words you are reading that say what you say calvin said in his post??? I\'m not seeing it.
Unless I misunderstood. These are the words:
\"In fact most hosting companies have privacy policy statements that state they will compile with subpoena as at the advice of my attorney I have done here.
I see Calvin is online here and will make some kind of post about this.
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Ummm, I guess maybe I can\\\'t read? But, would you mind telling me the words you are reading that say what you say calvin said in his post??? I\\\'m not seeing it.
Unless I misunderstood. These are the words:
In fact most hosting companies have privacy policy statements that state they will compile with subpoena as at the advice of my attorney I have done here.
I see Calvin is online here and will make some kind of post about this.
For some reason I am unable to modify my post.
I meant to say.
I see Calvin is online here maybe he will make some kind of post about this and clear this up.
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Calvin hasn't posted here about this yet.
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Calvin hasn\'t posted here about this yet.
It looks like he left.
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I think you misunderstood. My interpretation is that Calvin has posted a privacy policy at BSDA on the advice of his attorney:
http://www.blacksda.com/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=21991&view=findpost&p=244202
Ummm, I guess maybe I can\'t read? But, would you mind telling me the words you are reading that say what you say calvin said in his post??? I\'m not seeing it.
Unless I misunderstood. These are the words:
\"In fact most hosting companies have privacy policy statements that state they will compile with subpoena as at the advice of my attorney I have done here.
I see Calvin is online here and will make some kind of post about this.
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BSDA has a new Subpoena pending. Time for action is dead ahead.
Calvin posted on Blacksda yesterday that at the advice of his attorney he has complied with the subpoena.
I am rather surprised that neither Bob or you have announced that here yet.
http://www.blacksda.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21696&st=15&#entry251463
What you do not seem to understand is that we are not parties to the subpoena and it would be those represented by public citizen that would have to take action. We have not been noticed of a new date or time for deposition, let alone for production, but Calvin's position is no surprise. He had laid the foundation for a change in position early on and there is nothing there that is any damage to our case.
In fact, there is nothing there that would be of concern in any event. THe gestapo has little they can do to effectively use the information they think they will get. And even if they get it, other than intimidation, there is little they can really do with it. SO, if you have backbone and character, being known is not an issue. YUpou can either stand by what you say or you are factually challenged.
I will stand by what I have said. I am known and have never used a pseudonym!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
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BSDA has a new Subpoena pending. Time for action is dead ahead.
Calvin posted on Blacksda yesterday that at the advice of his attorney he has complied with the subpoena.
I am rather surprised that neither Bob or you have announced that here yet.
http://www.blacksda.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21696&st=15&#entry251463
What you do not seem to understand is that we are not parties to the subpoena and it would be those represented by public citizen that would have to take action.
Gailon Arthur Joy
I have gotten the feeling at times that people think that you and Bob are everyone's lawyers.
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Here is what Calvin is posting today on BSDA:
calvin
Rating: 0
View Member Profile
post Today, 07:20 AM
Post #27
site admin
Group Icon
Group: Owner
Posts: 2,904
Joined: 17-July 03
From: Omaha, Nebraska
Member No.: 1
Gender: m
I was asked this question in a PM.
Calvin, did you or are you planning to comply with the subpoena?
Answer:
No, I have not complied. As for planning to comply; it depends on if the cost becomes too great for me to financially continue to resist or I am order to comply by the courts.
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Thank you Johann, that is how I read it. But, since someone Jack saw it differently, I wanted to know how he got that.
Here is what Calvin is posting today on BSDA:
calvin
Rating: 0
View Member Profile
post Today, 07:20 AM
Post #27
site admin
Group Icon
Group: Owner
Posts: 2,904
Joined: 17-July 03
From: Omaha, Nebraska
Member No.: 1
Gender: m
I was asked this question in a PM.
Calvin, did you or are you planning to comply with the subpoena?
Answer:
No, I have not complied. As for planning to comply; it depends on if the cost becomes too great for me to financially continue to resist or I am order to comply by the courts.
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I am glad that is cleared up as I obviously misunderstood, and prefer to have the truth about it known.
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I am glad that is cleared up as I obviously misunderstood, and prefer to have the truth about it known.
Didn't take too many twists of the handle to get you to pop out. Your honesty is refreshing...Lord save us!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
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I am glad that is cleared up as I obviously misunderstood, and prefer to have the truth about it known.
I hope that does clear it up for everyone. I have not complied with any 3abn subpoena. However, at the advice of my attorney I have issued a privacy policy statement on BSDA that basically states that I reserve the right to comply with any legal subpoena.
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I am glad that is cleared up as I obviously misunderstood, and prefer to have the truth about it known.
I hope that does clear it up for everyone. I have not complied with any 3abn subpoena. However, at the advice of my attorney I have issued a privacy policy statement on BSDA that basically states that I reserve the right to comply with any legal subpoena.
Smart thing to do, Calvin.